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Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

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Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#31

Post by sdesol »

manuelmoreale wrote: post #7
fideloper wrote: post #3

Oh, it's PHP - neat. Personally I think Statamic is the entry to beat for flat-file CMSes in the PHP space. This project is the Symfony flavor I suppose (vs Statamic being based on Laravel).

Personally think https://getkirby.com is the entry to beat but I guess it’s just because I’m used to it and it works incredibly well for my use case.

The active community for kirby is bigger than grav's as the following shows:

https://devboard.gitsense.com/getkirby/kirby

https://devboard.gitsense.com/getgrav/grav

Historically speaking, grav is more popular as it had over 2000 contributors, compared to kirby which is about 500.

Full Disclosure: This is my tool

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#32

Post by nine_k »

I wonder how different it is from basically a static site generator re-generating pages once input files change, à la `zola serve`.

BTW I would be interested in a static site generator / CMS that extracts data from flat files (which are the source of truth) and puts them into a database that can be queried in interesting ways during page generation.

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#33

Post by manuelmoreale »

sdesol wrote: post #31
manuelmoreale wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally think https://getkirby.com is the entry to beat but I guess it’s just because I’m used to it and it works incredibly well for my use case.

The active community for kirby is bigger than grav's as the following shows: https://devboard.gitsense.com/getkirby/kirby https://devboard.gitsense.com/getgrav/grav Historically speaking, grav is more popular as it had over 2000 contributors, compared to kirby which is about 500. Full Disclosure: This is my tool

It’s two different projects run in two different ways. I don’t think that looking at git is useful or insightful in this case.

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#34

Post by stakhanov »

twic wrote: post #9

What is a flat-file CMS? What are CMSs that aren't flat-file? How many CMSs are there now? How come people are still making more? Why isn't this a boring, fairly stable commodity category the way web servers or something are?

Development of static or near-static websites is just a sector of the software engineering economy that's humongous in size/volume, so it's often bewildering if you're a software engineer in any other space to see just how much activity there is in that space, despite being relatively trivial.

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#35

Post by k4runa »

fideloper wrote: post #3

Oh, it's PHP - neat. Personally I think Statamic is the entry to beat for flat-file CMSes in the PHP space. This project is the Symfony flavor I suppose (vs Statamic being based on Laravel).

Statamic is great for simple sites but for larger or multilingual sites it has lots of problems. I have a 5000+ page website that the static site generator takes 3 hours to build and there's been no improvement since v3 launched. You can use their "Static Caching" as an alternative to static generating but for my project requirements I need a purely static site. I'm busy doing a huge rewrite and switching to using Statamic in headless mode with NextJS in the front... which takes just a couple of minutes to generate the static sites instead.

I'm also still waiting for RTL support for languages in the CMS and multi-site permissions which has probably been on the roadmap for over a year but keeps getting delayed. I've submitted many ideas and bug reports on how to improve the multilingual experience but I don't think it's a priority for the team.

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#37

Post by rtpg »

k4runa wrote: post #35
fideloper wrote: post #3

Oh, it's PHP - neat. Personally I think Statamic is the entry to beat for flat-file CMSes in the PHP space. This project is the Symfony flavor I suppose (vs Statamic being based on Laravel).

Statamic is great for simple sites but for larger or multilingual sites it has lots of problems. I have a 5000+ page website that the static site generator takes 3 hours to build and there's been no improvement since v3 launched. You can use their "Static Caching" as an alternative to static generating but for my project requirements I need a purely static site. I'm busy doing a huge rewrite and switching to using St…

Serious: you should run a profiler on the generation step (or like... for a minute of it and the CTRL-C out). Often times degenerate cases like this exist but are more or less invisible to maintainers, and just saying "the generator takes forever" is not nearly as actionable as "here's the first 60 seconds of the generation process, does anything look weird?"

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#38

Post by TheCapeGreek »

65 wrote: post #19

If only it wasn't built with PHP. We need a batteries included, non-headless, open source CMS for Node.js. Headless is pointless for the vast majority of use cases, so I don't really understand why Node.js developers keep making them. It's funny how CMSs follow the same design patterns based on the language. PHP CMSs are generally the same, Node.js CMSs are generally the same.

I agree. As a PHP dev it seems to me that the JS world is stuck on reinventing every kind of wheel for every kind of project.

From what my view as an outsider, it seems that there just isn't as much conglomeration around big projects as there is in PHP/Ruby/etc, or there are many more projects and there haven't been a "sacred few" as winners yet outside of frontend frameworks.

In PHP, I can reliably stick myself in a Laravel/Symfony/Wordpress camp and the framework will either have most of what I need, or the ecosystem will have packages for it that get the job done. In JS, the projects that accomplish the same either don't have much publicity or there's some other blocker.

In other words, where is Wordpress.js? Solve an entire problem for an end user, not just a fellow developer who can operate a terminal.

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#39

Post by WA »

k4runa wrote: post #35
fideloper wrote: post #3

Oh, it's PHP - neat. Personally I think Statamic is the entry to beat for flat-file CMSes in the PHP space. This project is the Symfony flavor I suppose (vs Statamic being based on Laravel).

Statamic is great for simple sites but for larger or multilingual sites it has lots of problems. I have a 5000+ page website that the static site generator takes 3 hours to build and there's been no improvement since v3 launched. You can use their "Static Caching" as an alternative to static generating but for my project requirements I need a purely static site. I'm busy doing a huge rewrite and switching to using St…

A very big German newspaper (https://www.spiegel.de/) runs on Statamic and they probably have an order of magnitude more pages. But not sure what kind of improvements/custom implementations they've done.

Re: Grav is a modern open-source flat-file CMS

#40

Post by tobimori »

sdesol wrote: post #31
manuelmoreale wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally think https://getkirby.com is the entry to beat but I guess it’s just because I’m used to it and it works incredibly well for my use case.

The active community for kirby is bigger than grav's as the following shows: https://devboard.gitsense.com/getkirby/kirby https://devboard.gitsense.com/getgrav/grav Historically speaking, grav is more popular as it had over 2000 contributors, compared to kirby which is about 500. Full Disclosure: This is my tool

Kirby has a very loyal customer base w/ lots of people that exclusively work with Kirby in their day job (like I am) - there's a new update? People report the first bugs in minutes. Huge benefit of Kirby imho (and also a reason why I prefer it over Statamic, Statamic people are often like "oh you have a question? yeah go look into github issues from over three years ago, i'm not here to help" tbh)
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