Have you read the court transcripts of El Chapo trial? Maybe, better read them, before you think you can safely contact drug cartels. Drug cartels are at least three moves away from your local drug dealer. Cartel folks deal with the wholesale distributors, who are some high level gang operatives. So, you can't even go past the first two levels, let alone the local high level gang operatives. These high level wholesale buyers interact with cartel people (mostly they are born and brought up in the states). And these people further interact with people in Mexico. This Mexican contact is in touch with the big cartel bosses. That's how the structure is laid out based on the transcripts.
Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
11–20 of 209 posts
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#12This site is insufferable sometimes.
I have an OPML file of my favorite creative geniuses from here. It helps me resist "the urge".
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#13You are planning suicide. It's that simple. You have nothing in common with the people who run drug cartels; it would be as safe to meet with grizzly bears.
You might be right. I would be happy with a Zoom meeting.
Why don't you just publish the idea and wait for the better angels of their nature to realize that being good is more in their long term interest than being bad? It's not like they don't do research or keep abreast of technology; if you just want to save humanity then go public and spread your idea as widely as possible while expecting nothing in return.
If you want to understand the sociopolitical dynamics of cartels and the strategic logic of their operations, I suggest this monograph: https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA599872.pdf
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#14who do you want to be safe from?
The Cartels themselves? Probably looking at finding someone who knows someone who knows someone. Maybe a billboard?
The government of your country who might not enjoy you assisting the cartels? You probably fucked that up already.
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#15Have you read the court transcripts of El Chapo trial? Maybe, better read them, before you think you can safely contact drug cartels. Drug cartels are at least three moves away from your local drug dealer. Cartel folks deal with the wholesale distributors, who are some high level gang operatives. So, you can't even go past the first two levels, let alone the local high level gang operatives. These high level wholesal…
I have read a few things about cartel org structures, but most of my knowledge is based on The Wire and Breaking Bad, and obviously those probably aren't too close to reality. The El Chapo transcripts are a great suggestion. Much appreciated.
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#16Earlier quoted context omitted.
You might be right. I would be happy with a Zoom meeting.
Why don't you just publish the idea and wait for the better angels of their nature to realize that being good is more in their long term interest than being bad? It's not like they don't do research or keep abreast of technology; if you just want to save humanity then go public and spread your idea as widely as possible while expecting nothing in return. If you want to understand the sociopolitical dynamics of cartel…
It's obviously a super complicated and morally fraught issue, but if I could enable a future with fewer fentanyl deaths and less border violence, that seems like it would be good progress. The current war on drugs does not seem to be making much progress.
But your point about just publishing the idea is well taken. This would not be a money making venture for me. A big part of the challenge of getting a cartel meeting would be convincing people that I wasn't wasting their time. That would likely involve establishing credibility somehow. It's an interesting problem.
I appreciate the pointer to that report. It looks fascinating. I'll read through it.
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#17I thought this was some sort of parody or joke - it sounds like some sort of Nigerian Prince scam pitch - but from your responses you are either genius at playing the whole thing straight or you are seriously out your depth and literally risking your life for no good reason.
First off, saying that you have an idea to "improve their [Cartels] profit margins" by itself is enough to fall foul of the US DEA. Even if you are not in the US, the DEA has plenty of official and unofficial routes to target you and make life unbearably difficult or extradite you to the US where they can really mess you about.
Fentanyl is primarily sourced from China and is knowingly brought in by cartels - it's not an accident it's in drugs and killing people and both China and the cartels are well aware of that and don't care. You're talking about people who torture indiscriminately and dump decapitated bodies in play parks to 'send messages' over minor issues like someone being on the wrong street that they consider their turf.
You're not going to get a "zoom call" with them and you're not going to be able to set up any sort of mutually beneficial business relationship.
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#18Are you Nathan Fielder?
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#19who do you want to be safe from? The Cartels themselves? Probably looking at finding someone who knows someone who knows someone. Maybe a billboard? The government of your country who might not enjoy you assisting the cartels? You probably fucked that up already.
Yes, my main concern is the cartels themselves. The most likely outcome is that none of them would ever agree to meet me. There is a very small chance that one or two would meet me, love the idea, and agree to cooperate. There's also a non-zero chance that in the process of trying to get a meeting, I would upset them somehow and they would take some action against me.
Another possibility is that even if the cartels like my idea, it might upset other parties in the supply chain and they could take action.
Billboard is a good idea. I'll look into that. What should it say?
Re: Ask HN: How could I safely contact drug cartels?
#20I thought this was some sort of parody or joke - it sounds like some sort of Nigerian Prince scam pitch - but from your responses you are either genius at playing the whole thing straight or you are seriously out your depth and literally risking your life for no good reason. First off, saying that you have an idea to "improve their [Cartels] profit margins" by itself is enough to fall foul of the US DEA. Even if you…
Nope, not a joke. Currently more of a thought experiment that could turn into a startup if it really seems viable.
I'm in the US and I would actually be very interested in chatting with the DEA about my idea. If it turns out there is no legal way to move ahead with my idea, I won't pursue it further. As I said, I'm not even sure what kind of lawyer I could contact to get advice about this kind of thing. Saul Goodman?
I'm aware that the fentanyl is added on purpose, but I don't think they want to add so much that it kills their customers.
Last year there was some discussion of legalizing cocaine production in Columbia. I think the plan was eventually rejected, but it seems like people are seriously considering creative solutions.