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Dashcam images reveal where police are deployed

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Re: Dashcam images reveal where police are deployed

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what to tell you. People were paid to protect someone's stuff, those people were called guards, but they weren't enforcing law. Some people were given ownership of a place and the people in that place, they were called lords or knights, but they weren't enforcing laws, they were enforcing their will. Some communities had expectations and rules, and the community was self policing - if you did theft, the…

> People were paid to protect someone's stuff, those people were called guards, but they weren't enforcing law. So you deny that some people were paid to enforce the law at some point of time somewhere? So the Code of Hammurabi was just a useless piece of stone nobody cared about? > Some people were given ownership of a place and the people in that place, they were called lords or knights, but they weren't enforcing…

Police departments in the US derived from English law, which had a system of unpaid enforcement via gentry. Prior to that, reeves were individuals charged with keeping the peace. Prior to that it was expected everyone contributed via frankpledge.

This takes us back to around the year 1000.

There's not much evidence of law enforcement prior to that in the direct historical lineage of US policing.

In other cultures we see military (gendarmes or "men at arms") and slaves being deployed to enforce laws. (Common in Rome and Byzantine culture.)

In other cultures a leader would create justifications and appoint a single person to ensure the jurisdiction was peaceful. That single individual was paid, and they likely hired guards when they wanted, but I generally wouldn't consider a guard or posse to be law enforcement in the way we understand that term today. Those roles were closer to bounty hunters. This is how the Egyptian pharaohs ran things thousands of years ago.

Hammurabi, btw, isn't like the inventor of laws. He just very famously decided to punish violence with violence. Sumerian law existed prior. But the existence of laws says nothing about their enforcement. If you've got good resources on Sumerian or Mesopotamian enforcement, I'd be interested, but it's pretty far off topic of the US law enforcement lineage.

Re: Dashcam images reveal where police are deployed

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People were paid to protect someone's stuff, those people were called guards, but they weren't enforcing law. So you deny that some people were paid to enforce the law at some point of time somewhere? So the Code of Hammurabi was just a useless piece of stone nobody cared about? > Some people were given ownership of a place and the people in that place, they were called lords or knights, but they weren't enforcing…

Police departments in the US derived from English law, which had a system of unpaid enforcement via gentry. Prior to that, reeves were individuals charged with keeping the peace. Prior to that it was expected everyone contributed via frankpledge. This takes us back to around the year 1000. There's not much evidence of law enforcement prior to that in the direct historical lineage of US policing. In other cultures we…

> Police departments in the US derived from English law, which had a system of unpaid enforcement via gentry. Prior to that, reeves were individuals charged with keeping the peace. Prior to that it was expected everyone contributed via frankpledge. > This takes us back to around the year 1000.

> There's not much evidence of law enforcement prior to that in the direct historical lineage of US policing.

There is. Police departments in England are derived from police departments in France.

> If you've got good resources on Sumerian or Mesopotamian enforcement, I'd be interested, but it's pretty far off topic of the US law enforcement lineage.

It is not. People in the US like to find idiosyncratic reasons for why things are so in the US and why their country is oh so unique, but the truth often is that things are like that everywhere —even in places where such idiosyncratic reasons couldn't exist.

Re: Dashcam images reveal where police are deployed

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Police departments in the US derived from English law, which had a system of unpaid enforcement via gentry. Prior to that, reeves were individuals charged with keeping the peace. Prior to that it was expected everyone contributed via frankpledge. This takes us back to around the year 1000. There's not much evidence of law enforcement prior to that in the direct historical lineage of US policing. In other cultures we…

> Police departments in the US derived from English law, which had a system of unpaid enforcement via gentry. Prior to that, reeves were individuals charged with keeping the peace. Prior to that it was expected everyone contributed via frankpledge. > This takes us back to around the year 1000. > There's not much evidence of law enforcement prior to that in the direct historical lineage of US policing. There is. Polic…

Great! Let me know what resources I should read up on.

Re: Dashcam images reveal where police are deployed

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what to tell you. People were paid to protect someone's stuff, those people were called guards, but they weren't enforcing law. Some people were given ownership of a place and the people in that place, they were called lords or knights, but they weren't enforcing laws, they were enforcing their will. Some communities had expectations and rules, and the community was self policing - if you did theft, the…

> People were paid to protect someone's stuff, those people were called guards, but they weren't enforcing law. So you deny that some people were paid to enforce the law at some point of time somewhere? So the Code of Hammurabi was just a useless piece of stone nobody cared about? > Some people were given ownership of a place and the people in that place, they were called lords or knights, but they weren't enforcing…

In earlier times, there was more decentralization. So, such decentralized localities couldn't be what we call states today. Yes, some elders, some wise men, some people with more clan-power, etc., were involved in settling property disputes that arose in their villages, camps, places, etc (whatever such locality could be called).

Re: Dashcam images reveal where police are deployed

#115
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big question is it because of their race or is it coincidental with the higher crime rate?

There's an elegant paper and analysis that addresses this in Minneapolis, another city that's had some DOJ attention for policing. https://lawandinequality.org/2020/11/24/does-the-minneapolis... The TLDR is that you can analyze the difference between stops on summer evenings (sunny) and winter evenings (dark) and detect a racial bias depending on whether officer can see the driver or not. The raw data is also availab…

The problem with that methodology is that it doesn't only hide race. Criminals tend to be repeated offenders. It only proves that the police couldn't recognize them.
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