The all-new Basecamp is live • Hacker News Board

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#111

Post by jasonfried » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 6:23 PM UTC

devmach wrote: post #73

gr366 wrote: post #14

I notice the new version is running on basecamp.com. The old version is at basecamphq.com and 37signals always made a point about the domain not mattering as much as the product name. I imagine there's a follow-up to that saying that if your product becomes successful there's nothing wrong with going and grabbing the pure domain (thinking Dropbox, Instagram and others. Or basically the opposite of Color.)

http://www.quora.com/37signals/Why-doesnt-37signals-own-base... They didn't own basecamp.com then, now they have. "Project name is bigger than domains" is a part of lie part of true: Product and it's name important but if you can't get the domain just be arrogant and say to people it doesn't matter. But because you know the importance of the domain name , when you have money and chance get the domain and rule the wor…

We purchased the domain from the previous owner a few months ago. We wanted to use it to launch the new Basecamp since the Classic version used basecamphq.com. We wanted to keep the URLs separate so this seemed as good a time as any to make it happen.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#112

Post by jasonfried » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 6:25 PM UTC

pilsetnieks wrote: post #91

gr366 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like they're gradually simplifying. They originally launched with a range of domains you could choose from: projectpath.com, clientsection.com, grouphub.com, etc. with a subdomain. Then it went to subdomains on basecamphq.com, and now just basecamp.com with no subdomains.

I remember yourname.seework.com from a previous job. As a result, all of the project managers called it Seework, not Basecamp.

That's exactly what happened. It was actually confusing for people since different people on the same project were referring to Basecamp with different names. That's one of the reasons we migrated everyone to basecamphq.com and now, basecamp.com on the new accounts.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#113

Post by jasonfried » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 6:26 PM UTC

ckluis wrote: post #67

andycroll wrote: post #25

Interesting that they've taken an new approach to SEO for their feature pages... a long list of vaguely project management named pages.

Makes perfect sense to me. I'd also say its not vague - they probably spent a great deal of time naming the pages/titles from a usability & SEO standpoint. I like the redesign a lot.

Thanks. To be honest, we didn't think much about SEO here at all. We thought about customers. Well written pages that speak clearly and explain products thoroughly are automatically good for SEO. SEO gains are side effects of good writing.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#114

Post by tomkin » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 6:33 PM UTC

ahlatimer wrote: post #110

tomkin wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, great products. I use Basecamp everyday as well, but we are also dependant on "Time", although I side with the philosophical argument that the "Time" feature is essentially useless. I would want to get rid of it, too. Here's why: project managers like to think it's a way of predicting the next project timeframe. It's a giant fallacy. In no way, shape or form, does Time keeping give you any sense of what to e…

[T]he "Time" feature is essentially useless…[P]roject managers like to think it's a way of predicting the next project timeframe. There's more to time management than just prediction. When I was working for a company doing client work, we used Basecamp to keep track of how long we spent on each project so we could bill appropriately.

Of course, I don't doubt that. We just don't use it for that, so for me it makes sense not to have it from my point of view.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#115

Post by ry0ohki » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 6:48 PM UTC

tchock23 wrote: post #93

Am I the only one here who thinks they've actually done a good job with this transition? I've been a long-time (paying) user of Basecamp and the entire 37 Signals suite, and I think Basecamp needed to be revamped long ago. I actually like that they've created a brand new experience/product, and have given everyone ample time (90 days) to evaluate whether or not they like it. I also thought the FAQ was clear, and the…

It feels kind of weak to me. 37sigs used to be very vocal and strong about what they believed. "Here's our way, and you'll like it or not". This seems like they are really couching their bets... If no one likes the new one, they won't have lost their cash cow, if they do like the new one, they've made an easier transition for others.

I'm afraid what actually will happen is 45-50% will be on the new Basecamp, and 50% on the old, and it will be confusing to clients who sometimes use the old, sometimes use the new, etc... Will be interesting to see how it plays out, as with everything 37sigs does, it's innovative and if it works I wouldn't be surprised to see more people taking a similar approach.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#116

Post by jmilloy » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 6:50 PM UTC

jasonfried wrote: post #76

robinjfisher wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a company that goes on about transparency and clear speaking etc., the answer to the second question you've quoted is appalling. It doesn't answer the question at all. It should be: Will you continue to improve Classic? No. We will fix any bugs or other problems that stop our customers using Basecamp Classic but we will not be developing new features. Our focus now is on improving Basecamp Next so that Classic cu…

What's appalling about it? It's not necessarily true that we won't add new features. This is day one right now. We don't know how things will pan out. It's disingenuous to say we won't do something that we might do. As stated, the majority of our resources will go towards the new Basecamp. That's honest and as clear we can be without misleading anyone.

It's unfortunate then that in this case the honest and clear answer sounds like glossy PR-speak.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#117

Post by tchock23 » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 7:05 PM UTC

ry0ohki wrote: post #115

tchock23 wrote: post #93

Am I the only one here who thinks they've actually done a good job with this transition? I've been a long-time (paying) user of Basecamp and the entire 37 Signals suite, and I think Basecamp needed to be revamped long ago. I actually like that they've created a brand new experience/product, and have given everyone ample time (90 days) to evaluate whether or not they like it. I also thought the FAQ was clear, and the…

It feels kind of weak to me. 37sigs used to be very vocal and strong about what they believed. "Here's our way, and you'll like it or not". This seems like they are really couching their bets... If no one likes the new one, they won't have lost their cash cow, if they do like the new one, they've made an easier transition for others. I'm afraid what actually will happen is 45-50% will be on the new Basecamp, and 50%…

Interesting point about clients being confused with two different versions... Although it's a remote possibility, I could see it being confusing for someone who works with one vendor who swears by Classic and another who has migrated up to Next.

I also agree that this could be seen as inconsistent with their stance on making opinionated software. However, I put myself in their shoes and see only a couple of options - you either revamp Basecamp with a new design/user experience and risk a huge backlash from your customer base, or you build a brand new product and give people the choice. I'd go with the latter option.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#118

Post by mapgrep » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 7:05 PM UTC

atourgates wrote: post #98

dhh wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're launching with a great set of features we could do in a reasonable amount of time. If we had tried to reimplement every single Basecamp Classic feature in Basecamp Next before we launched, it would have taken a very long time. Basecamp Classic originally launched without even file uploads! We'll be busy bees making Basecamp Next fill in gaps all over the place in the coming months. Looking into how we can solve…

That's great to hear - but why does it take a rant on HN to communicate that integrating Time Tracking with Basecamp Next is a high priority? If you're committing to adding Time-Tracking in the future, publicize it, so users like me will be confident that it's worth sticking with Basecamp. Until that happens, you're telling us, "Sorry, you're not our target user base."

DHH seems shy about mentioning this so I will: 37signals has been thinking about killing time tracking. See the "Goodbye" list here. http://37signals.com/svn/posts/3110-basecamp-next-the-goodby...

There is a disclaimer, "Some stuff on the Goodbye list is completely gone from Next, while other things are just executed differently enough that they don’t resemble the way things worked in Classic... There’s some stuff on Goodbye that we ended up keeping."

That said, it's probably worth keeping this "goodbye list" in mind when DHH says carefully hedged things like how the team is "looking into how we can solve people's time tracking needs with a great workflow in Basecamp Next." There's a good chance that will NOT be time tracking as you know it.

Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I don't think you should be kept waiting around for a feature that may be axed.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#119

Post by cmelbye » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 7:14 PM UTC

mef wrote: post #47

I enjoyed the ad for wysihtml5 in the console on pages that use it. "Heya! This page is using wysihtml5 for rich text editing. Check out https://github.com/xing/wysihtml5 First time I've seen that, but makes sense for an OSS project to promote itself to people who would have the console open, i.e. devs.

And it looks like a fantastic WYSIWYG editor, at that. I'm definitely going to replace my hacked together contenteditable editor with it.

Re: The all-new Basecamp is live

#120

Post by lunaru » Tue, Mar 06, 2012, 7:35 PM UTC

jasonfried wrote: post #77

zavulon wrote: post #51

No milestones? What are we supposed to use instead of it? Our workflow heavily depends on them ..

They're called events now. You can add them to the calendar or on the Events section of a project page.

Jason, I think the confusion is that your example Project is so nicely fleshed out, people use it to grok the entire range functionality within a project. Because there is no sample Event, people will miss the small "Add Event" link hidden at the top of the page.