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Guam: The America that Americans forget

nytimes.com

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Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#61

Post by jcranmer »

mc32 wrote: post #19
c_o_n_v_e_x wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know someone who grew up near a US base in the Philippines. Her father was employed as a cook at the base. When the base was closed, they went back to eeking out a living through subsistence farming. There are some positive economic impacts for the locals.

Then there is Okinawa and like a thorn, despite all their rejection, we remain unwelcome squatters.

Well, it depends on which "they" you're referring to. The Japanese love hosting the US bases there, except that Okinawa is to Japan largely as Puerto Rico is to the US, and the Okinawans themselves are quite unhappy to be the actual hosts (surely not helped by soldiers' predilections for raping local girls).

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#62

Post by ted_bunny »

c_o_n_v_e_x wrote: post #18
sreejithr wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about those islanders though? "Power projection" is important. But it's sad that its at the expense of human beings who live and work there.

I know someone who grew up near a US base in the Philippines. Her father was employed as a cook at the base. When the base was closed, they went back to eeking out a living through subsistence farming. There are some positive economic impacts for the locals.

Capitalism good according to capitalism

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#63

Post by dumpHero2 »

givemeethekeys wrote: post #56
calgarymicro wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did they ever want to keep it? It was my understanding that, as with Mexico following the Mexican American War, many in the US didn't want permanent integration due to racial sentiments; the thought of giving tens of millions of Filipinos US citizenship horrified them.

Ordinary American citizens didn't like the idea of being colonizers, since they had, not long ago, been a colony themselves and fought to free themselves.

Oh, they love a part of it. The part where they get the cheap labor, but not the part where they hang around for too long and start asking for human rights.

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#64

Post by reillyse »

throwawaaarrgh wrote: post #39
messe wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue then is if you have checked luggage.

So get your luggage? Deboarding, going through immigration, getting luggage, and going through customs takes no more than 45 minutes at Narita. Give yourself a 2 hour layover to be safe. Or pack like Rick Steves and just bring a backpack with the essentials.

A backpack and a production crew :)

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#65

Post by skissane »

givemeethekeys wrote: post #56
calgarymicro wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did they ever want to keep it? It was my understanding that, as with Mexico following the Mexican American War, many in the US didn't want permanent integration due to racial sentiments; the thought of giving tens of millions of Filipinos US citizenship horrified them.

Ordinary American citizens didn't like the idea of being colonizers, since they had, not long ago, been a colony themselves and fought to free themselves.

> Ordinary American citizens didn't like the idea of being colonizers, since they had, not long ago, been a colony themselves and fought to free themselves.

Bad comparison: the American Revolution was a group of colonialists rebelling against their colonialist bosses, not a rebellion of the colonised against the coloniser. Indeed, one of the American Revolution’s complaints was that London was too protective of Native American rights, and was limiting its colonies expansion into Native American territories. So rather than an anti-colonialist rebellion, it was a pro-colonialist rebellion

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#66

Post by CobaltFire »

r24y wrote: post #54
wayne wrote: post #25

The article touches a little on flight costs, but as someone who'd love to visit sometime and never has, it annoys me how flights to Guam work. Given its location most airlines don't fly direct from the mainland, so many flights to Guam are from Asia. But, you can't buy a ticket from the US with a layover in Japan from JAL or with a layover in Korea from Korean Air because any flight with a US origin to a US destinat…

Flight costs are a pain, and the flight durations are nothing to sneeze at either. I live out in Guam (my wife is stationed here with the Navy) and the two most common ways to get back to the mainland are via Tokyo (Narita) and Honolulu. I would definitely encourage visiting if you have the means! I find there are two types of people here: those who feel limited by the island and its infrastructure (no Target, no Sta…

My family and I loved our time there (Navy as well).

We almost retired there, but my son's health condition(s) precludes that.

Space-A is how we flew back during our tour there, and if you know the tricks it work great. If you don't it's a nightmare.

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#67

Post by cscurmudgeon »

> As tensions with China mount, the U.S. military continues to build up Guam and other Pacific territories — placing the burdens of imperial power on the nation’s most ignored and underrepresented citizens.

Oh NYT never change. If the country never did, you would bet the NYT would have something like below:

> As tensions with China mount, the U.S. military continues to ignore Guam and other Pacific territories — endangering on the nation’s most ignored and underrepresented citizens.

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#68

Post by impissedoff1 »

calgarymicro wrote: post #33
givemeethekeys wrote: post #27

Forgetting what is America is one of the reasons Americans lost the Philippines as a territory.

Did they ever want to keep it? It was my understanding that, as with Mexico following the Mexican American War, many in the US didn't want permanent integration due to racial sentiments; the thought of giving tens of millions of Filipinos US citizenship horrified them.

[flagged]

Re: Guam: The America that Americans forget

#70

Post by jjulius »

jcranmer wrote: post #59
mc32 wrote: post #4

Ah, yes, the island that could capsize, if we load it up with too much materiel, according to a particular US Senator... Guam is like Guantanamo, or Diego Garcia. We're there only because they are of strategic importance for the post-war (WWII) projection of power and nothing more. Else all those little island bases would be quiet places like so many other small islands that dot the oceans.

> We're there only because they are of strategic importance for the post-war (WWII) projection of power and nothing more. Are you aware that the US acquired Guam decades before WWII?

Not taking a stance one way or another, but the reason for remaining somewhere can be wholly different from the reason you acquired that locale in the first place.
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