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Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

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Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#111

Post by lolinder »

sitkack wrote: post #110
lolinder wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know the details of what happened here? Unless you know otherwise, it sounds like your father probably ended up clicking the "renew subscription now" button when prompted, not that simply logging in triggered the charge. I'm ready to believe that the renewal prompt was heavily geared towards making it easy to renew, and Netflix should be required to make it equally easy to cancel, but unless you know he didn't…

No the onus is not on the customer to not step on the landmine.

My point is that we don't know if it was a landmine or a very clearly labeled bit of C4 with a lever next to it labeled "explode".

I've logged into a cancelled Netflix account before, and while they definitely want you to renew, there's a very clearly marked button that includes the renewal price. If OP's dad absent-mindedly clicked that button, that's a very different story than if simply logging in and navigating to a movie issued a new charge.

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#112

Post by metiscus »

cad1 wrote: post #108
LanceH wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And most of these don't allow removing the last card on file, even if it's cancelled.

I was going to mention this dark pattern too. So many sites have no way of removing a payment method. It should really be illegal, but until then I will use virtual card numbers.

Otherwise, in cases where you have a very pernicious party that will absolutely not stop charging your card, you can contact your bank and have them cancel that card. When they do, there is often a convenience feature that allows pre-existing subscriptions to continue to bill using the old card info. You need to make sure you tell the bank that you do not want that to happen for this card. They have a way to shut that feature off and that will remove the ability for the company to abuse that feature. You can still end up accruing a debt with them that they may try to collect on eventually so this is not a suggested method to get out of a subscription, but when you have tried everything else, it does seem to work in my experience.

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#113

Post by RGBCube »

atahanacar wrote: post #103
RGBCube wrote: post #37

In Turkey, you can cancel any subscription you have through the governments app called "e-Devlet" which stands for "e-Government". It is an awesome system, a service making it hell to unsubscribe? Just cancel it through e-Devlet and if they don't cancel your subscription, you can sue them. Though I think it only works for Turkey based companies, sadly.

For more context, prior to this, ISPs would force you to send them a cancellation notice over fax (which nobody has) if you wanted to cancel your subscription, even though they would come to your house to sign the contracts when first subscribing. There exists a law that states "cancellation can't be harder than subscription" and if you intend to cancel a subscription but an easier way is not provided, you aren't leg…

> Also, "you can sue them" in this context means "you can use e-Devlet to sue a company online, without having to leave your house".

e-Devlet is awesome in this regard, I am still suprised lots of more developed countries don't have anything similar. It is like a swiss knife for healthcare, financial and legal services. The e-Devlet app is also pretty fast and the webpage does not suck.

Though I wish the signup process was simpler, because you need to go to the nearest government post office to get an account. But I guess it is like that to prevent impersonation.

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#114

Post by dangus »

atum47 wrote: post #82
lolinder wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know the details of what happened here? Unless you know otherwise, it sounds like your father probably ended up clicking the "renew subscription now" button when prompted, not that simply logging in triggered the charge. I'm ready to believe that the renewal prompt was heavily geared towards making it easy to renew, and Netflix should be required to make it equally easy to cancel, but unless you know he didn't…

I have talked to my father, he did not clicked anything. By simple watching after the final date they gave us it triggered a renewal. the solution proposed in the chat was to logout every device at once and delete my credit card so that wouldn't happen again.

> By simply watching after the final date they gave us…

Yeah if I stay in my apartment after my lease expires my landlord is gonna charge me rent. Obviously, Netflix shouldn’t have let you in, but…

> I have talked to my father, he did not clicked anything.

I learned long ago not to trust technological recollections coming from my parents.

Ironically, Netflix was actually right about password sharing: someone else with your login credentials can do whatever they want. For all you know your dad is mad that he’s losing Netflix and hit the renew button.

Of course, it would be nice if Netflix would create a family sharing mechanism like Apple and Google have.

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#115

Post by littlecranky67 »

throwaway2990 wrote: post #41
littlecranky67 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UX is great, but not worth paying 30% more.

Singapore a year of Disney plus is $120 from Disney. It’s $120 on iOS. HBO go is same price. Prime video is same price. The only one I can’t pay for is Netflix. So your point is moot.

You are right, and of course there is not always a surcharge. I myself am a big fan of easy it is to cancel when using Apple Subscriptions. However, there are tons of online services that WILL charge your a significantly higher subscription fee, when using Apple Pay (Tinder is a prominent one).

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#116

Post by gabeio »

lolinder wrote: post #93
atum47 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What if you dad is lying to avoid embarrassment? Shouldn't matter, right?! Once I cancelled was not supposed to be charged again unless I agree to it. If my father wanted to renew the subscription, he should use his card, right? the renewal process should function as a new subscription, if not done by the same person that subscribed in the first place.

Were you and your father using two separate usernames/passwords? Or a shared login? If it was a shared login then Netflix would have reasonably assumed that you authorized the charge. If it was a separate account, you have a point—only the plan owner should be able to renew the plan.

Unless I am missing something there is no way to have more than 1 login for netflix. Everyone uses shared logins.

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#118

Post by neximo64 »

atum47 wrote: post #89
themitigating wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love to test this because I'm pretty sure that simply using netflix after you canceled will not start the subscription again without any prompt. What if you dad is lying to avoid embarrassment?

> What if you dad is lying to avoid embarrassment? Shouldn't matter, right?! Once I cancelled was not supposed to be charged again unless I agree to it. If my father wanted to renew the subscription, he should use his card, right? the renewal process should function as a new subscription, if not done by the same person that subscribed in the first place.

Its really likely your father renewed the subscription with consent, and forgot about it.

Netflix doesn't auto renew simply by watching. It asks you to renew the subscription. It requires conscious consent.

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#119

Post by tuxychandru »

Why is it still the norm in the US to allow companies to charge their customers whenever they please, without the customers having any control?

In India, businesses are required to get a consent, at the time of subscription, to charge the customer on a recurring basis. This is called an e-mandate and requires multi-factor authentication to create. The card holder can cancel the mandate online, through their bank, without having to rely on the business doing the right thing. The business cannot charge the customer beyond that point, without obtaining a new mandate.

Re: Disney, Netflix, and more are fighting FTC's 'click to cancel' proposal

#120

Post by lolinder »

gabeio wrote: post #116
lolinder wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were you and your father using two separate usernames/passwords? Or a shared login? If it was a shared login then Netflix would have reasonably assumed that you authorized the charge. If it was a separate account, you have a point—only the plan owner should be able to renew the plan.

Unless I am missing something there is no way to have more than 1 login for netflix. Everyone uses shared logins.

They recently added support for sharing your plan with an "Extra Member", for an additional fee:

https://help.netflix.com/en/node/123279

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