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When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

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Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#361

Post by theptip »

lldb wrote: post #161
ryandrake wrote: post #27

I’m all for the “fake data” idea, but also: Apps should be required to gracefully handle the cases where users deny permission to access real data. I know last time I developed for iOS, it was Apple’s policy that apps cannot punish users or exit() the app in retaliation for them denying a permission. Apps must gracefully handle it and continue running. Also, and this was even longer ago, apps could not require users…

Worst offender is google photos on iOS - you can’t even open the app without giving it all photos access. Selected photos doesn’t count. Even just to view photos already saved in the cloud.

Agreed, so obnoxious, especially since as you say the OS has a “select some photos” permission setting that they should be able to play nice with.

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#363

Post by freedomben »

jddj wrote: post #222
freedomben wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems like a great policy to me. I bought a guitar tuner app in the past and that's exactly and all it did: act as a tuner. But it then got acquired by a company that sells guitar lessons and other things, and they completely f-ed up the app and it requires an account and a subscription now if you want to tune your guitar. Fortunately there are other options in the Play Store, but I paid like $15 or $20 for it a…

I only go to F-droid for these utility apps. Guitar tuners, flashlights, QR scanners, etc. Open source hobby-sized projects which are done when they're done.

This is a terrific strategy! I'm going to do exactly this. Thanks for sharing.

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#364

Post by supertrope »

paradite wrote: post #169

WeChat has this feature. When you authorize a third party mini program in WeChat to access your personal information, you can choose to generate a fake profile for the mini program instead of supplying your real information. Here's an article in Chinese describing the feature: https://www.woshipm.com/pd/2612572.html Another article with slightly worth page experience: https://jingyan.baidu.com/article/c275f6ba22f54ca…

Wechat itself asks for GPS data upon startup. On Android if you deny the permission the app closes.

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#365

Post by supertrope »

immibis wrote: post #163
jeroenhd wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That only disables the permission or increases the uncertainty, it doesn't really feed fake data. If apps refuse to work unless you provide detailed location info or other permissions, there's no "provide fake data" option like the post suggests.

Apps can use GeoIP to get an approximate location most of the time, and there's nothing Google can do to prevent it.

There's a significant difference between "Your ISP's IP block suggests you are near Stockton,CA" and "Your exact location +/- 5 meters"

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#366

Post by JimDabell »

epoch_100 wrote: post #320
JimDabell wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> on iOS, you cannot distinguish if you were granted a permission or not. This isn’t correct. For instance, accessing location services provides CLAuthorizationStatus: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/corelocation/claut... …and push notifications have UNAuthorizationStatus: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/usernotifications/... …and health data has HKAuthorizationStatus: https://developer.apple.com/…

> but you cannot distinguish between limited access and full access I believe you can check whether you received limited photos access: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/photokit/phauthori...

Sorry, you’re correct. I was thinking of the case where older applications receive PHAuthorizationStatus.authorized when the user has selected restricted. There are newer APIs to handle the restricted access changes.

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#367

Post by zzo38computer »

leshenka wrote: post #219
post-it wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The technical solution is to make the output of having denied permission identical to the output of there being no data. On iOS, if you deny permission to access devices on the local network, the app has no way of knowing - it just sees that there are no devices available.

> being no data "but sure you have photos on your phone, if your phone tells me there aren't any then it's lying" Yeah, fake data. I remember there was an Android Xposed(?) mod that did that, was quite funny to see heaps of fake names in contact list

But it is possible to not have photos on your phone, e.g. if it is a new one, or if you prefer to use a separate camera, or you are not the person to take pictures.

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#368

Post by kennyloginz »

kerkeslager wrote: post #305
charcircuit wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>no, that's impossible When you are a platform owner it is important that you evaluate the needs of all stakeholders and not just the needs of the users of the platforms. Telling app developers that you are not willing to compromise is not a great way to convince them to create apps for your platform. Also as a platform you want your platform to appear as a safe place for content owners to have their content on. You…

> When you are a platform owner it is important that you evaluate the needs of all stakeholders and not just the needs of the users of the platforms. I disagree. The literal entire purpose of every single non-user entity involved in this situation is to serve users, and if it's not serving users, then that's a systemic failure. If corporations want a place at the table, they should be serving users, and if they can't…

I worked for a couple years at a company that delivered electronic assessments. Their use case makes sense for control of the device ( these assessments were usually delivered to a classroom environment where proctors could observe physical cheating ). It took a lot of pushback with Apple to be allowed to “not allow screenshots”. Which, I think, is pretty great that they originally pushed back, but then understood the product.

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#369

Post by fsckboy »

Cyberdog wrote: post #332
devilbunny wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me push back against that a bit. My phone is not a fashion piece. AFAICT the blue bubbles will show up with an old 4S just as well as with a 14 Pro Max. I have an iPhone - which I got after many years with Android - because iMessage is an essential app for me. I live in the US, so my business partners do not have [choice of alternative messaging app] installed and they are not going to install it just for me. I'm…

> Or how Apple is being a gigantic bunch of assholes by not using something other than vanilla SMS if you're not an iMessage user. What alternative would you suggest? And is that alternative as universal as SMS?

a system that can deliver messages through SMS or wifi is better, especially one that was a protocol, not a product, and would allow multiple platforms to access

Re: When an app asks for permissions, it should have a “feed fake data” option

#370

Post by patch_cable »

crazygringo wrote: post #301
lldb wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Worst offender is google photos on iOS - you can’t even open the app without giving it all photos access. Selected photos doesn’t count. Even just to view photos already saved in the cloud.

That's incorrect, I just tried it on iOS. When you open it, it defaults to the "Photos" tab which has a message (not a dialog) asking for all photos access. But if you switch to any other tab (like Search or Library) you've got access to all of your photos in the cloud. On the one hand you wouldn't realize that if you never tried tapping another tab. But on the other hand, the main "Photos" tab is designed to access…

It’s partially correct. I installed the Google Photos app with the intention of sharing some photos from my phone to a shared album. As far as I can tell, it is not possible to give Google Photos access to a limited selection of photos. The app just tells you to go back and give access to all photos.
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