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Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

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Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TBH the way you explain it sounds to me like 1st and 2nd year stem students were disengaged and uninterested in solidarity with their academic peers who have less options than them. I'm not even particularly fond of the humanities I just don't understand why you wouldn't fight for the allowance for your peers to start families, god damn!

> I'm not even particularly fond of the humanities I just don't understand why you wouldn't fight for the allowance for your peers to start families, god damn! What the GP said was that instead of taking a cash option that would benefit all members, they chose benefits that only benefitted parents. It's reasonable to be angry that an alternative that would benefit all members wasn't chosen.

https://taa-madison.org/history/

> TAA activists in the Fall of 2008 also turned their eyes again toward attaining Domestic Partner Benefits for TAA members and UW employees. The TAA pushed on the issue, joining the LGBT Campus Center to table on Library Mall during their Coming Out Week, and creating a memorable Bascom Hill display. The TAA then networked into the University’s Domestic Partner Benefit Task Force, and arranged meetings with Governor Doyle’s Office and UW Chancellor Biddy Martin, while activists also spoke with nearly a thousand TAA members about the importance of winning Domestic Partner Benefits. The State Legislature, which in years past had meticulously denied state employees Domestic Partner Benefits, was poised for a sea change in the November elections. The TAA’s Political Education Committee launched an AFT COPE award-winning program, through a vibrant and ambitious series of phone banks and Labor Walks throughout south-central Wisconsin. Though Domestic Partner Benefits were not ultimately won in the 2007-2009 contract, the TAA was responsible in ensuring that the issue would be considered in the 2009-2011 budget.

https://etf.wi.gov/publications/et2166/download?inline=

> As of Sept. 23, 2017, the State of Wisconsin no longer allows the establishment of new domestic partnerships under Chapter 40 of the Wisconsin statutes.

> Carefully review this document if you are in a Chapter 40 domestic partnership established before September 23, 2017 because it contains important information about the benefit changes for established domestic partnerships.

> If you are currently in a domestic partnership that was established under Chapter 40 between Jan. 1, 2010 and Sept. 22, 2017, your domestic partnership remains in force for the Wisconsin Retirement System retirement benefit administered by the Department of Employee Trust Funds. Your domestic partner is also still eligible to be the beneficiary of your life insurance policy, either through retention of your validly established domestic partnership, or through the submission of a Beneficiary Designation (ET-2320 or ET-2321) form.

(note the date when domestic partnerships established would benefit from the benefits that spouses traditionally got - https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/40 )

Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#84
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You obviously have absolutely no clue how research PhDs work . Somehow my 6 years of PhD in physics begs to differ. As I said in another comment, grad students are going to grad school and getting a big bump to their future earning potential, subsidized often by the state. I don't think it's an entitlement that they get to do that for free, much less claim a right to earn living wage level on top of that.

Maybe you were doing a CS PhD or something, but PhDs in most fields are not a good good way to maximize earning potential, especially when taking into account lost potential wages and the time value of money.

>> my 6 years of PhD in physics

> Maybe you were doing a CS PhD or something

LOL

> PhDs in most fields are not a good good way to maximize earning potential, especially when taking into account lost potential wages and the time value of money.

Nobody made anyone get a PhD in a field that doesn't pay, and so that doesn't mean they're entitled to high pay.

It's not hard to google "starting pay for major x" before making a choice. Nobody should be surprised at what the pay is, especially for someone capable of getting a PhD.

Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#85

When given the opportunity, few people will vote against something that gives them more money. But whether their self-interest is in the broader interest is rarely solved for by such a mechanism. What will happen is that given a finite pot of money, fewer grad students will be taken on by the university's PhD programs, so that the ones who voted for this can get paid more. I'm not sure that's the right choice.

It’s the right choice. We need academia to be a competitive choice, to attract top talent, to not just be those with enough resources or enough passion to put up with awful pay and working conditions.

If high quality grad students are lining up to apply to Stanford at non unionized salary rates, and you can also give more people the educational opportunity with slots than if you had to distribute higher salaries to fewer people, why would I choose the 2nd option?

Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's okay to be ignorant about how weird things work, but sharing opinions about things you don't know about should be avoided. A PhD "student" isn't really a student. They're an employed researcher at a research institution, working under more senior researchers who are able to attract grant money. To use an analogy to the trades, the PhD students are the apprentices, the senior researchers / professors are the jour…

Yeah, I was a grad student in physics for 6 years, so feel free not to offer opinions on things you don't know about. Grad students are getting an education and a big bump to their future earning potential, often at significant taxpayer expense. What entitlement do they have to have a free ride, much less make living wage on top of that?

[deleted]

Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is objectively the right choice to enable people to build families if they're going to be in a program until their late 20s! This sounds ridiculous to me on its face-- why the hell wouldn't you support your maximally educated populace (getting doctorates) to have families? The 1st and 2nd year STEM kids (literally kids-- you can enter into a masters fresh out of college, so like 21-23 yrs old) who see the…

Calling 22 year olds "kids" and then also saying they have a lack of solidarity with their older "peers" seems a bit insensitive to me. People having families is great, but if their benefits come from the expense of your own salary, that's asking for more than solidarity; that's asking for altruism.

[deleted]

Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I was a grad student in physics for 6 years, so feel free not to offer opinions on things you don't know about. Grad students are getting an education and a big bump to their future earning potential, often at significant taxpayer expense. What entitlement do they have to have a free ride, much less make living wage on top of that?

Your perspective on taking 6 years to do a PhD is that you feel you should have paid for it?

Didn’t say that. I think that grad students are reasonably paid a small salary to be able to live modestly on, so that more students can be taken into programs. Requiring a living wage to the tune of $50k/yr at UC Berkeley as the standard is not reasonable as a matter of spending university $ wisely, or as a matter of what the role of grad school is.

Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#89
post #30

A big part of the reason these unionization efforts are happening: https://csstipendrankings.org/ Many universities are not paying a living wage for the area they are located in.

The phrase used to be "starving grad student", maybe now it's not a jest anymore, and it falls flat ...

Re: Stanford Graduate Students Won Their Union Vote

#90
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Union favored the 8th year humanities students at the expense of the 1 and 2 year STEM students Having been a one-time 1st or 2nd year STEM student, I think this is the proper decision.

Caused huge attrition of the 1st and 2nd year stem students (i.e. quit with a masters). The union was dominated by humanities students, and they fought for what they wanted, not what the overall membership wanted. Very few STEM folks had any interest in being part of the union, but because so many voted with their feet, it was hopeless to set up a decertifiying petition.

Democracy isn't perfect, but checking out is the quickest route to ensuring your interests are only minimally represented. True at all levels of democratic organization.
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