43% of white Harvard students are legacy, athlete, or donor/staff related (2019) • Hacker News Board

Re: 43% of white Harvard students are legacy, athlete, or donor/staff related (2019)

#141

Post by ashwagary » Tue, Jul 04, 2023, 2:17 PM UTC

catiopatio wrote: post #87

losteric wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let’s be honest, though — this is just whataboutism. This is classism. Shockingly, institutions can have both classist and racist discrimination - let's be honest, they're both bad and need to go.

If that’s your take, great. I agree. I don’t believe that’s why legacy admissions are being brought up now, though. I think people are trying to make the case that legacy admissions are another form of affirmative action that largely benefits white americans. They’d be wrong, of course. Legacy admissions are classist, not racist. Being white inferred no advantage under their legacy admissions policy — in fact, the op…

Screaming meritocracy until the finger is pointed at my particular group.

No way to justify legacy admissions which are racist at their core (blame the historically racist US population) with a thick coating of 'classism' used as cover.

Re: 43% of white Harvard students are legacy, athlete, or donor/staff related (2019)

#142

Post by dang » Tue, Jul 04, 2023, 5:32 PM UTC

lametrol wrote: post #69

[flagged]

Users are flagging your comments—correctly, because you're posting unsubstantive flamebait. That's not what this site is for.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: 43% of white Harvard students are legacy, athlete, or donor/staff related (2019)

#143

Post by runsWphotons » Wed, Jul 05, 2023, 12:14 AM UTC

tchaffee wrote: post #140

runsWphotons wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it won't. Plenty of legacy admits are "diverse" now. And with increase of standards from banning affirmative action, legacy status will be the best chance of many from "diverse" backgrounds.

Why are you putting diverse in quotes? Do you have data supporting your claim that "plenty of legacy admits are diverse"? By definition the legacy admissions are very similar to previous attendees. You need to explain how that would increase diversity.

You brought up diversity, so what kind do you mean? Going forward, post affirmative action, just by test scores and gpa almost all students admitted at top schools will be asian or white. But there have been five decades where significant numbers from other races have attended these top schools and their kids and siblings can benefit from legacy admissions. (For example, this year ~15% of Harvard freshman were Black) Legacy admissions will absolutely increase this kind of diversity. If you get rid of it, it may further slightly benefit asians over whites, but I am not sure this increases "diversity".

Re: 43% of white Harvard students are legacy, athlete, or donor/staff related (2019)

#144

Post by tchaffee » Wed, Jul 05, 2023, 6:14 AM UTC

runsWphotons wrote: post #143

tchaffee wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you putting diverse in quotes? Do you have data supporting your claim that "plenty of legacy admits are diverse"? By definition the legacy admissions are very similar to previous attendees. You need to explain how that would increase diversity.

You brought up diversity, so what kind do you mean? Going forward, post affirmative action, just by test scores and gpa almost all students admitted at top schools will be asian or white. But there have been five decades where significant numbers from other races have attended these top schools and their kids and siblings can benefit from legacy admissions. (For example, this year ~15% of Harvard freshman were Black)…

Please answer my questions first.

Just test scores and GPA have never been the only factor and never will be. For example universities aren't looking for robots who are just good test takers. I'm surprised you're speaking on this subject but seemingly haven't done the homework and aren't aware of what existing practice is and what the ruling still allows.

Going forward almost nothing will change in outcomes. The ruling said universities are allowed to use a student's life experience of racism as a factor. Harvard already highlighted this in their public response to the ruling. That's not race but it is a very strong proxy for race isn't it?

Legacy admissions can only maintain the status quo so there will be no increase in diversity if legacy admissions continue. To increase current diversity levels you would have to put some effort into it. The status quo rarely changes organically when it comes to gaining or losing power.