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Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

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491–500 of 503 posts

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#491
post #469
post #325

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I think you can do this with

Why should one have to do this? The slippery slope of what is ok goes straight from this to copyright laundering via LLMs.

Why shouldn't they? This is basic fair use. Google is giving them an out they don't have to.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#492
post #469

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should one have to do this? The slippery slope of what is ok goes straight from this to copyright laundering via LLMs.

Why shouldn't they? This is basic fair use. Google is giving them an out they don't have to.

Fair Use isn't a thing in Canada.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#493
post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's no imbalance here: newspapers produce content, search engines/social networks surface and link to it. The imbalance is that as platforms , newspapers cross-subsidize content. Interesting headlines attract readers to the newspaper, but once in hand readers are likely to continue reading the other, less unique articles. (See also why newspapers carry sports scores and comics). An investigative report is by it…

Personally I'd be happy to see the ad driven model die. It used to be that people bought newspapers or didn't read them. They still had some ads, granted, but far less intrusive than today's web ads with their colours and animations. I'm huge into supporting good journalism, and think we need some sort of intervention here. But I'm very very strongly opposed to this new law. If news sites want to charge for their con…

> If news sites want to charge for their content they should put it behind a pay gate.

This is the 'trade journalism' model. Here, good journalism still exists, but the price is more than most people would afford. People buy trade journals when the news is important, with direct financial implications that justify the cost of admission.

General journalism, however, is something close to a public service. It's better in a vague, hand-wavy way to have an educated citizen body that's informed about current affairs, but few individual citizens derive much value from their own knowledge. (This is also why people tend to gravitate towards 'entertaining' news, by some definition. Come for the sports scores, stay for current events.)

In this model, the benefit of news is externalized. I benefit when other people are educated. This is a classic market failure, and it suggests that a reader-pays framework will underprovide news.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#494

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What claims can be made with current information in your opinion? Is the Trudeau regime , just another run of the mill Canadian government or possibly something more sinister (or at least more corrupt).

I don't claim to be super-knowledgeable on this topic but IMO the current government is marginally competent and so far I'd say they seem about as corrupt as the Liberals normally are, which is to say: unacceptably. I'm not sure they're any worse than previous iterations, but history will decide. The emergency measures act stuff seems like it was mishandled to me. I find the leadership to be heavy-handed with the vir…

My take on carbon tax is it is mostly an income redistribution scheme which moves wealth from the middle to lower classes while reducing the size of the middle class.

If it does have a material global impact on carbon emissions it will only be a result of somehow shaming other countries to reduce their own emissions. While I can’t find any estimate of how much the carbon tax will reduce emissions, our empty country only has 1.89% to work with. So the forest fires are not going to stop as a result of the tax alone.

I suspect what will happen is other countries will innovate their way out of the problem while Canadians embrace pointless atonement leaving the country weaker and poorer as a result.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#495

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't claim to be super-knowledgeable on this topic but IMO the current government is marginally competent and so far I'd say they seem about as corrupt as the Liberals normally are, which is to say: unacceptably. I'm not sure they're any worse than previous iterations, but history will decide. The emergency measures act stuff seems like it was mishandled to me. I find the leadership to be heavy-handed with the vir…

My take on carbon tax is it is mostly an income redistribution scheme which moves wealth from the middle to lower classes while reducing the size of the middle class. If it does have a material global impact on carbon emissions it will only be a result of somehow shaming other countries to reduce their own emissions. While I can’t find any estimate of how much the carbon tax will reduce emissions, our empty country o…

Entirely plausible, Canada as a country coasts on our relative affluence and resource base far too much, I'd like to see us pushing money into R&D for technological solutions as well.

I know what you're saying about our contribution to emissions, but I feel like the most basic principle of good faith when you're trying to get another party to do something like this is to deal with your own shit first, otherwise it's just hypocrisy. Every country in the world can look at their own contributions and say "well, most of it isn't our fault, so why should we fix it until somebody else does?". Rightly or wrongly, Canada likes to think of itself as a world leader, so let's put our big boy pants on and step up.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#496
post #472

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then maybe the government should focus instead on forcing them to be open?

How would a Canadian government force an American company to be more open?

The same exact way they are doing here - pass a law requiring the company to comply with certain standards if it wants to operate in Canada and lawfully provide services to Canadian customers. Standards that could, for example, include the requirement for all content on the platform to be indexable. Or even to mandate open protocols and federation.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you remove physical violence as a mean of interaction, you gain something else which would be violence by any other name. Government minimization is favored the most by those who would gain from the lack of counterbalance. In the case of market economy, if you can't use violence, then the world would be split into natural monopolies and monopolies after market consolidation. Everyone else will be feudalized beca…

Ok, now explain how free market economies have improved the quality of life and lifted more people out of poverty than any other economic system in history.

Energy. Last few hundred years humanity unlocked new sources of energy. Free markets are a good distribution mechanism, but by themselves they fail at the point when there is no new input in the system. As I said above, there are some other prerequisites like free entry, free participation, plus enough information. Otherwise, the market collapses. free markets are not self-sustaining and if you want for the system to work, you should maintain it.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My take on carbon tax is it is mostly an income redistribution scheme which moves wealth from the middle to lower classes while reducing the size of the middle class. If it does have a material global impact on carbon emissions it will only be a result of somehow shaming other countries to reduce their own emissions. While I can’t find any estimate of how much the carbon tax will reduce emissions, our empty country o…

Entirely plausible, Canada as a country coasts on our relative affluence and resource base far too much, I'd like to see us pushing money into R&D for technological solutions as well. I know what you're saying about our contribution to emissions, but I feel like the most basic principle of good faith when you're trying to get another party to do something like this is to deal with your own shit first, otherwise it's…

“Big boy pants” and “stepping up” are meaningless phrases intended to elicit and irrational emotional response. Let’s instead focus on the phrase “solve the problem” and work backward from there. The current carbon tax scheme does very little to concretely solve anything - entirely hinging on factors outside of our control such as the ability to influence China.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#499

My read on this is that news organizations are upset that Google/Facebook are taking profits by providing cached content that makes people not want to actually click their links. If this is the primary concern, though, then wouldn't it make more sense to draft a law regulating content caching, rather than the pay-per-click approach? It seems like a law that said "Sites that serve any content which wasn't part of a 'y…

It is trivial, absolutely, absurdly trivial, for any site to opt out of Google caching.

Re: Bill C-18: Google to remove news links in Canada over online news law

#500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm not willing to pay for a paywall then the "best" content is not behind a paywall, because I won't read it. My definition of "best" includes my ability to actually read the content under my terms.

If I ask you what is the best restaurant in town, will you answer that it's your mommas house because there you always eat for free? Cost has nothing to do with determining the quality of a search result, and search engines shouldn't discriminate against paywalled content. But I think it's a good idea to let users like you check a box to hide paywalled results.

That's an insane take on what I said.

No, I won't answer my mommas house because you can't just show up and eat there as a restauraunt. It doesn't fit the search criteria you asked for.

If you ask what the best restauraunt in town is, I'll give you a restauraunt.

If you ask what the best restauruant in town is, I won't send you to a place where you can buy a "best restauraunts in town guide" for 5 bucks, because that's not what you're asking for.

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