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Plastics are poisoning us

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Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#511

Post by shortcake27 »

literalAardvark wrote: post #489
shortcake27 wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steel is not recycled by consumers. You cannot put steel in a recycling bin. You _ may_ be able to take steel to a resource recovery centre. However if the travel uses oil or electricity that comes from coal, I wouldn’t be surprised if this ended up being worse for the environment than a PET bottle. With regards to leaching, the FDA has declared PET bottles safe for repeated use.

Electricity coming from coal is not something you address by using plastic bottles. There's almost nothing worse than forever plastics at this point in time. They're everywhere, they're toxic, and we don't know how to fix it. Steel is recycled as often as it's economically feasible to do. It's not hand selected by consumers because there's already a whole process for dealing with metals in general that's been in plac…

> Electricity coming from coal is not something you address by using plastic bottles.

That’s not my point and I think you’re deliberately misinterpreting it.

> In the US it's probably put on a barge and stripped in Mexico or something, no idea. It's rarely thrown out though, as it's very expensive and very useful.

This sounds like wishful thinking. Do you have any evidence to support this claim? “Don’t worry, just trash it and it’ll probably get sorted in Mexico” doesn’t inspire confidence.

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#512

Post by shortcake27 »

literalAardvark wrote: post #492
shortcake27 wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steel is not recycled by consumers. You cannot put steel in a recycling bin. You _ may_ be able to take steel to a resource recovery centre. However if the travel uses oil or electricity that comes from coal, I wouldn’t be surprised if this ended up being worse for the environment than a PET bottle. With regards to leaching, the FDA has declared PET bottles safe for repeated use.

Oh and a note I neglected to make: the recycling failure scenarios are wildly different for steel and PET: steel is easily disposed of by the environment, and doesn't really cause any problems, in fact it's a great oceanic fertilizer. PET is a horror show in the failure scenario.

Yeah that is a good point.

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#513

Post by [deleted] »

friend_and_foe wrote: post #473
okeuro49 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All it takes is a handful of lifestyle changes I don't think this for a second. I think the only way it will stop if equivalent biodegradable materials can be made to replace single use plastic.

This is an apathetic mindset and is part of the problem. "I can't do anything! The whole world has to change or it can't be done!" It's not healthy to disempower yourself with respect to your own life. I do it, so it can be done. Everyone will be different everyone has tolerances, but it can be done. People make the problem larger than life so that they have am excuse not to do anything. The only thing you can change…

[deleted]

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#514

Post by GivinStatic »

falloutx wrote: post #144

Remind me why should we save the environment/planet? At this point its owned by big corporations and governments, so it should be them who need to save it.

We don't. This planet will get along just fine, we humans on the other hand..

This planet has seen cataclysms, mass extinctions and destruction on planetary scale, it'll be fine. Not us.

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#515

Post by literalAardvark »

shortcake27 wrote: post #511
literalAardvark wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electricity coming from coal is not something you address by using plastic bottles. There's almost nothing worse than forever plastics at this point in time. They're everywhere, they're toxic, and we don't know how to fix it. Steel is recycled as often as it's economically feasible to do. It's not hand selected by consumers because there's already a whole process for dealing with metals in general that's been in plac…

> Electricity coming from coal is not something you address by using plastic bottles. That’s not my point and I think you’re deliberately misinterpreting it. > In the US it's probably put on a barge and stripped in Mexico or something, no idea. It's rarely thrown out though, as it's very expensive and very useful. This sounds like wishful thinking. Do you have any evidence to support this claim? “Don’t worry, just tr…

Steel is at 80%

https://pubs.usgs.gov/periodicals/mcs2021/mcs2021-iron-steel...

PET is at 30%

https://www.epa.gov/facts-and-figures-about-materials-waste-...

Is your particular bottle going to be part of the 20%? IDK... but it's more likely by definition that the PET one is going to be part of the 70%, and is also more damaging in every possible way.

Except when dropping it on your foot.

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#516

Post by abwizz »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #312
elric wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably, you have eyes, and can easily avoid glass pollution. That's what I do when I go around barefoot. I've stepped in/on all kinds of nasty shit, but never on anything sharp. If you don't have functioning eyes, I apologize, and imagine being blind and barefoot is a tricky combination.

Man, we’ve got to chill with the condescension on here (often guilty of it myself because I too am a stinker). Every time I’ve stepped on glass, it was a tiny sliver I couldn’t see which is why I stepped on it.

thanks for beeing the voice of reason.

all i wanted to say is that glass bottles are no silver bullet because they also have negative consequences.

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#518

Post by deanCommie »

asoneth wrote: post #432
yulker wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soapy water won't break down the molecularly bonded fat and iron on your cast iron. If you mistake leftover grease for seasoning, then sure, soapy water will get rid of it. The trick to not sticking on steel pan is just preheating it properly. A drop of water should dance on a properly heated steel pan and things won't stick. Just let it get hot enough.

> Soapy water won't break down the molecularly bonded fat and iron on your cast iron. In that case I'm not sure what the exact mechanism was. But I know that after others have used/cleaned a seemingly well-seasoned pan I've had to deal with chips, flakes, and/or rust and had to go back through the whole annoying seasoning process. And of course it's entirely possible that despite carefully following instructions that…

It's gaslighting by the cast iron/stainless steel crowd, pure and simple.

I've talked to multiple experienced and home chefs about this disconnect and they've admitted two things:

1) cooking on a screaming hot pan is possible of course. It's how all professional kitchens work. But it's way harder! You have to pay close attention & the timing for error is very small. Cooking at lower heat on Teflon lets you make more adjustments.

2) After doing everything perfectly, and seasoning perfectly, for the same heat you ABSOLUTELY still need more of some oil or butter on a cast iron or stainless steel then you would for an equivalent Teflon pan. This is non-negotiable.

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#519

Post by deanCommie »

rngname22 wrote: post #249
oezi wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand that Teflon might be a hazard in pans but feel like it reduces the amount of burned food in contrast to steel/iron pans so much for me that I hope it is a net gain. (sorry in advance for all who want to suggest iron skillets. I can't make them work in daily use.)

This is a bit like saying asbestos may be a hazard in walls but I just can't seem to get the knack for not lighting my house on fire :( I say that partially as a joke but also it does sort of sound a bit absurd, in the sense that your cooking techniques are just sort of wrong if you are repeatedly burning food to your non-non-stick pan. You need an oil or fat on your pan to provide a buffer or to bathe the food in li…

You just perfectly illustrated why people keep disagreeing about this.

You can cook a lot of things on a "non stick" telfon pan without an oil or fat.

You can cook far fewer things on a "non stick" cast iron without an oil or fat.

But the cast iron crowd will gaslight the rest of us, and claim that we are just seasoning it wrong but otherwise it is indistinguishable and only superior.

It's like manual transmission.

Re: Plastics are poisoning us

#520

Post by daddylongstroke »

VoodooJuJu wrote: post #307
realshadow wrote: post #11

I became a minimist to save the planet as much as i could. Its easier than any one could think you know. Here is what i have been doing for a decade and would receommend 1. Reusing plastic bags (i love cotton bags but not ideal). Fold and keep one or two in your pocket before you leave home 2. Support and use light software so you dont need to upgrade your gadgets (12y laptop i use) 3. Prepare and eat home cooked mea…

This stuff feels good on a personal level and does absolutely nothing to "save the planet" or our ailing bodies. Still tons of plastic everywhere throughout our lifestyles, primarily from industry and infrastructure. The entire chain of things you listed are riddled with plastic. Tools in the manufacturing and shipping processes, to build the roads, insulation, millions of miles worth of pipes for fuel, insulation, w…

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