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Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

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Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#101

Post by saulpw »

giraffe_lady wrote: post #47
jcims wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The description might be a bit indulgent, but the experience resonates. Having a conversation about flowers and your mind wants to talk about why there seems to be an innate attraction towards the scent of certain flowers. Like what is the electrochemical process that creates sensation in your mind of attraction and beauty and a pleasant experience when a certain set of chemicals bind to receptors in your head. But t…

There's no brain so big it prevents you from just enjoying the smell of the flower instead.

Note though that it was a conversation about flowers, possibly at a party with no flowers in sight. Imagine it went like this:

jcims: So what kind of hobbies are you into?

Bob: I love my garden, I planted several new flowers last weekend in fact.

jcims: Oh? What kind of flowers are you growing?

Bob: These latest are Lenten roses, I know a lot of people find the smell a bit unpleasant, but I actually prefer it to the zinnias.

jcims (sober): Isn't it interesting how there seems to be an innate attraction towards the scent of certain flowers. Like what is the electrochemical process that creates sensation in your mind of attraction and beauty and a pleasant experience when a certain set of chemicals bind to receptors in your head.

Bob: I don't know about chemistry, I'm just a gardener.

---

Alternately:

jcims (tipsy): That's cool! I've never heard of Lentil roses. Do they smell different than real roses?

Bob: chuckle Finally, a pleasant party conversation! The last person I talked with must have had a Ph.D. in neurochemistry or something, they started talking about electroreceptors and I just couldn't think of anything smart enough to say.

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#102

Post by kelipso »

toolz wrote: post #90
johnfn wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How could intellect, or the ability to reason and understand things ever be a problem connecting socially? Really? You don't think that intelligence has multiple components - raw intelligence, social intelligence, etc? And that you could in theory be good at one but not at the other?

Sure, but analytical intelligence surely doesn't get in the way of social intelligence I wouldn't think. So my statement holds in that case where you lack some type of intelligence. I can't see any reason that someone who is really intelligent at technical things couldn't be just as socially intelligent. They probably just don't have as much practice with social environments when compared to technical problems.

It's received wisdom from 80s American movies and media that sprung from that: if you're smart, then you're a nerd and therefore bad at being social. And the converse fallacy comes into play too: if you're bad at being social, then you're a nerd and smart.

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#103

Post by dubcee349 »

giraffe_lady wrote: post #51
Blahah wrote: post #9

Drinking slows down my brain and reduces the number of threads running in parallel. Sometimes very useful to enable normal-passing interaction in social environments. Or just to be able to focus. Lots of people with ADHD drink to achieve a more single threaded experience. Edit to add: I don't meant to encourage drinking as a tool for managing ADHD. It works but it's a blunt and dangerous tool. If you're at that point…

Untreated or late diagnosed ADHD people are ridiculously overrepresented in drug & alcohol recovery programs. It's honestly chilling and it prevents me from taking this in the probably more lighthearted spirit that was intended.

People with ADHD tend to be impulsive. you know what drugs are great for? Impulsive people.

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#104

Post by rexer »

t09i209ba893 wrote: post #88
oceanplexian wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I like being in full control over what I experience and how I experience it. I would argue you like the illusion of being in control, not that you are actually in control of anything. Some of the greatest decisions of my life were made after a few drinks (Such as booking flights to other countries, hooking up with people, making lifelong friends). Sometimes our rational, thinking minds aren't as smart as they think…

>I would argue you like the illusion of being in control, not that you are actually in control of anything. Could you elaborate about not how you aren't really any more in control when sober? I feel that you're making an interesting argument, but I don't really share your perspective well enough to understand what you mean. My aversion to alcohol largely comes from wanting my best judgement intact in order to better…

> Could you elaborate about not how you aren't really any more in control when sober?

Not the person you responded to, but I can give it a shot.

I think the crux is that you don't have as much control as you think you do, even when sober. Whether you realize it or not, you're still at the whims of yourself and environment: emotions, time of day, exhaustion, pressure. You can't think or analyze yourself out of that. So sure, you may take more risks when drinking, but so what? Do what feels right in the moment.*

* Y'know, within reason. Buying plane tickets = good, getting a forehead tattoo = bad.

> My aversion to alcohol largely comes from wanting my best judgement intact in order to better survive complex situations.

This really resonates with me, and it's something I'm actually try to minimize. I've been finding being present -- and not attempting to foresee and prepare for uncomfortable situations -- to be a much happier place to be. And should a scary situation arise, I trust my future self to handle it appropriately. Or he won't, and that's fine too!

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#105

Post by Blahah »

giraffe_lady wrote: post #51
Blahah wrote: post #9

Drinking slows down my brain and reduces the number of threads running in parallel. Sometimes very useful to enable normal-passing interaction in social environments. Or just to be able to focus. Lots of people with ADHD drink to achieve a more single threaded experience. Edit to add: I don't meant to encourage drinking as a tool for managing ADHD. It works but it's a blunt and dangerous tool. If you're at that point…

Untreated or late diagnosed ADHD people are ridiculously overrepresented in drug & alcohol recovery programs. It's honestly chilling and it prevents me from taking this in the probably more lighthearted spirit that was intended.

It wasn't meant to be lighthearted at all. It was just meant to be honest. I've been to the depths of the things, and I wish I knew how to help others not go there.

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#107

Post by nucleardog »

com2kid wrote: post #68
giraffe_lady wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Untreated or late diagnosed ADHD people are ridiculously overrepresented in drug & alcohol recovery programs. It's honestly chilling and it prevents me from taking this in the probably more lighthearted spirit that was intended.

Fun fact! Over 50 percent of people with untreated ADHD will have problems with substance abuse at some point in their life! Oh wait, that isn't fun at all. ADHD is real and untreated it can (and often does) destroy lives. (Also: People with untreated ADHD have 3x the gen-pop rate of car accidents!)

Current thinking is ADHD is caused (at least in significant part) by a lack of dopamine or an insensitivity to dopamine. They’ve found links between genes that cause dopamine resistance and ADHD.

Many current ADHD medications cause increased levels of dopamine. This is a leading theory on why they work.

Wanna guess what a lot of other drugs, including alcohol, do in your brain?

It’s been amazing since I got diagnosed relatively late in life exactly how many other things suddenly made so much more sense and clicked into place. And amazing how quickly decades old substance abuse habits started to taper off once my brain chemistry was less fucked.

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#108

Post by dang »

mynonameaccount wrote: post #4

[flagged]

Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.

If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#109

Post by 127 »

shortcake27 wrote: post #11
ProllyInfamous wrote: post #2

People ~~do~~ abuse drugs to escape seemingly-insurmountable problem(s) in their life. "The opposite of addiction is connection" ——Gabriel Maté I have been "clean" from a past life for 14 years. Every day is a challenge.

Eh, I don’t think it’s that deep. I take drugs because it feels good and I have a good time, so the risks are worth it. I have zero interest maximising my lifespan at the expense of enjoyment. I’ll never understand why the general population is so hell-bent on preventing people from enjoying their own life.

Drugs give peaks, but take away from the baseline. The result is less enjoyment in total.

Re: Leo Tolstoy on why people drink (2014)

#110

Post by asimovfan »

It's actually a replacement for mindfulness. We think this will help, bring us more to the "present moment", let us enjoy moment to moment experience of life more. All things that we do that is optional to life is basically like this. Smoking as well.

When one develops mindfulness a bit this becomes quite apparent.

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