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Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

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Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#41
post #5

Guess which one you can't benchmark and publish results on.

It really is amazing. From Oracle's Service Agreement: 4.2 You may not, or cause or permit others to: perform or disclose any benchmark or performance tests of the Services, including the Oracle Programs, without Oracle’s prior written consent; It's nuts!

Sadly this is also true of a lot of database software; there are similar clauses for DB2 and SQL Server.

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#42
post #7

> We use this very fast RDMA network, and we start with that. And in our Gen2 Cloud, our entire network is a super-fast network, which means that most of the applications you run in the Oracle Cloud are going to be much faster than our competitors’ clouds because they don’t use that kind of network. So we have huge cost advantages. So instead of giving actual metrics, just say "very fast", "super-fast" and "much fast…

Gives a very Trump-like feeling.

When you have an army of lawyers, they just let you sue them.

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#43
post #36

They don't even bother trying to make this sound believable. You claim it's 1.5x-2x faster? Sure I might believe that despite your prohibition against benchmarks. 10x faster? You better show how your engineers pulled out that miracle. 1000x? You've either picked out a very weird edge case, used something in a way it's not meant to be used, or just made that up. Anyone who's done any serious benchmarking in a competit…

It's MySQL Heatwave. Pretty sure this is referring to analytics usage. Clickhouse has a similar claim. If you look at https://benchmark.clickhouse.com/ and pick Clickhouse and Aurora for MySQL you get something in that ballpark. Heatwave claims to be faster than both Snowflake and Clickhouse.

In that case the fairer comparison should have been to Redshift, though I will concede that Amazon walked into this one themselves by overhyping Aurora's OLAP capabilities.

OLTP != OLAP, and the sooner database vendors learn to stay in their lane and focus on one use case, the better.

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#44

Title is a bit misleading, since Oracle is the brand and well as the a specific database product, he is claiming that Oracles cloud hosted version of mysql is faster than AWS Aurora, not claiming that Oracle DB is faster than mysql.

That is _probably_ what he means, but there is nothing in the quotes in the article to confirm that is _actually_ the case.

Also, the comment at the end of the article "... RDMA and other key drivers behind Oracle’s ascent to being the world’s hottest major cloud vendor" demonstrates that the person who wrote the article is not interested in asking hard questions. Oracle Cloud is quite a way from being the "hottest cloud vendor" by any meaningful metric, right now.

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#45

> we have customers moving from Amazon Aurora where they’re experiencing a 1,000x speedup versus Aurora. > So we’re a thousand times faster in query processing than Amazon’s version of MySQL No, “some customers are experiencing 1,000 speedup”, even if true, does not imply that, in general, your db offering is 1,000 faster.

> No, “some customers are experiencing 1,000 speedup”, even if true, does not imply that, in general, your db offering is 1,000 faster.

When you put a giant memory based parallel query engine in front, it's definitely possible to be 1000x faster :).

Heatwave adds a cluster of memory based columnar storage to MySQL. It's not your typical disk based query.

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#46
Larry, you are getting spanked by Oceanbase.

You haven't even bothered to compete since SPARC.

When you're back in the game, let us know.

  Tencent          814,854,791
  Oceanbase        707,351,007
  Oracle 11g SPARC  30,249,688
https://www.tpc.org/tpcc/results/tpcc_results5.asp?print=fal...

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#47

They don't even bother trying to make this sound believable. You claim it's 1.5x-2x faster? Sure I might believe that despite your prohibition against benchmarks. 10x faster? You better show how your engineers pulled out that miracle. 1000x? You've either picked out a very weird edge case, used something in a way it's not meant to be used, or just made that up. Anyone who's done any serious benchmarking in a competit…

It seems like he was comparing an in-memory columnar datastore to a disk-based row-oriented database for OLAP workloads. So it certainly falls in the "used something in a way it's not meant to be used" bucket, and maybe also in the "very weird edge case" bucket if the implication is that a big company is going to keep a material chunk of its analytics data in RAM.

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#48
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's MySQL Heatwave. Pretty sure this is referring to analytics usage. Clickhouse has a similar claim. If you look at https://benchmark.clickhouse.com/ and pick Clickhouse and Aurora for MySQL you get something in that ballpark. Heatwave claims to be faster than both Snowflake and Clickhouse.

In that case the fairer comparison should have been to Redshift, though I will concede that Amazon walked into this one themselves by overhyping Aurora's OLAP capabilities. OLTP != OLAP, and the sooner database vendors learn to stay in their lane and focus on one use case, the better.

Oracle claims it works for both OLTP and OLAP.

I mean on the fundamentals Heatwave adds a giant memory cache / query engine in front. That alone makes it faster than anything disk based.

As to Redshift, yes, they claim it's faster than Redshift too by quite a bit.

(I use claim as it's against the ToS to benchmark it independently)

Re: Larry Ellison: Oracle Database 1,000x Faster Than AWS Aurora

#49
post #7

> We use this very fast RDMA network, and we start with that. And in our Gen2 Cloud, our entire network is a super-fast network, which means that most of the applications you run in the Oracle Cloud are going to be much faster than our competitors’ clouds because they don’t use that kind of network. So we have huge cost advantages. So instead of giving actual metrics, just say "very fast", "super-fast" and "much fast…

> We use this very fast RDMA network ...

So, Infiniband then. It's not like they're the only ones using it, nor the only ones using it at scale.

Even Azure has it as an option:

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/virtual-machines/ove...

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