The damaging results of mandated return to office • Hacker News Board

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#41

Post by throwaway675309 » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 2:34 AM UTC

There have been a lot of, at least to me, somewhat unsubstantiated criticisms that fully remote work is difficult for new graduates. I can only provide n=1 sample data, but back when I was working for a company that was fully remote, we brought on many junior engineers who lived across the United States and didn't have any problems onboarding them by keeping a continual slack team huddle running during office hours.

In a lot of ways, it was actually better for them because they could have a multi monitor set up and be looking at one of our shared screens while taking notes on the other one instead of a bunch of people crammed up against one laptop screen in an office.

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#42

Post by iJohnDoe » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 2:39 AM UTC

Everyone is still compiling data from different vantage points. I don’t think anyone knows what it means yet.

2008 implosion? Nothing? A new evolution? Unemployment armageddon? Something totally new we don’t have a model for yet?

Some people thinking history repeating itself as usual and nothing new? Then those people should tell us what’s next if they claim to know everything. After all, it’s a repeat, so they should know already.

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#43

Post by DarthNebo » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 2:40 AM UTC

I used to just leave my work laptop back in the office locker, coz apparently we can't work from home anymore so no 'emergency/important' work after 5PM lol.

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#44

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 2:41 AM UTC

CtrlAltDelete51 wrote: post #32

alistairSH wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except almost all white-collar offices (in the US at least) went remote during the first 2-3 years of COVID. Most did so successfully. Yet, many now want to return to traditional office work with little evidence that’s a better way to work.

You have a source for any of that? Speaking personally, everyone I’ve spoken to on the matter (myself included) have zero desire to return to a traditional office.

[deleted]

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#45

Post by xwdv » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 2:42 AM UTC

I’m wondering if some residential buildings will start incorporating luxury co-working office areas where remote workers can stroll into and work amongst other people who WFH in the same building. Kind of like a WeWork. A place for people to find a desk and hang out for a change of scenery, and perhaps meet some locals. It seems like this would almost be necessary for remote workers who don’t have fancy homes but just have a simple studio or 1 bedroom apartment that gets very boring after a while.

This would probably kill off whatever co-working space businesses are left out there.

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#46

Post by VirusNewbie » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 2:43 AM UTC

CtrlAltDelete51 wrote: post #32

alistairSH wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except almost all white-collar offices (in the US at least) went remote during the first 2-3 years of COVID. Most did so successfully. Yet, many now want to return to traditional office work with little evidence that’s a better way to work.

You have a source for any of that? Speaking personally, everyone I’ve spoken to on the matter (myself included) have zero desire to return to a traditional office.

I like going to the office, i know many people who prefer it.

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#47

Post by toomuchtodo » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 2:51 AM UTC

welshwelsh wrote: post #27

bigbillheck wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's what we'll get Only if we're not willing to fight for more.

It doesn't have to be a fight. If you want to work remotely, apply for remote jobs at remote companies. There is no need to negotiate or bargain or convince anyone of anything.

> There is no need to negotiate or bargain or convince anyone of anything.

With a third of your life spent at work (at least, but hopefully less), this is no way to go through life. Everything is up for negotiation.

People who want to attempt to unionize to get the right to work remote can do so, as organizing is federally protected activity in the US and it only takes 30% of employees of a bargaining unit to petition the NLRB to hold a union vote: https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/what-we-do/conduct-elections

This is a labor rights issue, plain and simple. It makes little sense to be subjugated to management edict “because they say so” when there are labor tools available.

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#48

Post by RestlessMind » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 3:06 AM UTC

CtrlAltDelete51 wrote: post #32

alistairSH wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except almost all white-collar offices (in the US at least) went remote during the first 2-3 years of COVID. Most did so successfully. Yet, many now want to return to traditional office work with little evidence that’s a better way to work.

You have a source for any of that? Speaking personally, everyone I’ve spoken to on the matter (myself included) have zero desire to return to a traditional office.

Heh, you ask for a source and then just provide a personal anecdote?

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#49

Post by RestlessMind » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 3:08 AM UTC

alistairSH wrote: post #25

diego_moita wrote: post #19

I wish we stopped with the "companies should do this/should do that". Existing big companies are too comfortable and lazy for the remote work revolution. Remote work is a radical change in culture and work organization. It will take new companies with new workflows and organizational ideas to make it work well. We're not there yet. Managers don't understand yet how to do it, they need to read a lot of documentation (…

Except almost all white-collar offices (in the US at least) went remote during the first 2-3 years of COVID. Most did so successfully. Yet, many now want to return to traditional office work with little evidence that’s a better way to work.

> with little evidence that’s a better way to work.

You are assuming that decision makers are dumb. I disagree with that. My null hypothesis is that they are smart, competent people and are doing the best decision according to data they are seeing.

Re: The damaging results of mandated return to office

#50

Post by RestlessMind » Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 3:11 AM UTC

diego_moita wrote: post #19

I wish we stopped with the "companies should do this/should do that". Existing big companies are too comfortable and lazy for the remote work revolution. Remote work is a radical change in culture and work organization. It will take new companies with new workflows and organizational ideas to make it work well. We're not there yet. Managers don't understand yet how to do it, they need to read a lot of documentation (…

> Walkable, safe and cheap places with good internet have a lot to gain

Unfortunately, they will have a lot to lose by not being cheap anymore. At least for the locals. See Lisbon or Boise, for example.