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How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

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Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#71

Post by paddw »

hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #53

It’s becoming impossible to practice what you preach when it comes to data privacy. ‘Don’t like it, don’t buy it’ is difficult to execute unless you don’t mind not having a car, mobile phone, tv, browse the internet or even go out in a public place. There needs to be regulation and at least the ability to at least easily opt out of any of this insanity, but until there’s one (or probably many) widespread data-breache…

imo, if you don't want the government to track you, the battle is already lost, but there is probably room to limit what private companies are allowed to do on the regulatory front.

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#72

Post by nobody9999 »

voz_ wrote: post #41
ep103 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its bizarre to see the "I have nothing to hide, so why should I care" defense on the top of Hacker News. Post Scriptum: If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him. - Cardinal Richelieu You have to move to feel the chains.

That’s not what I am saying, actually. I think tracking should be illegal. But I don’t live in a fantasy world. My point was that in our real world, where everything already tracks me, who cares?

>That’s not what I am saying, actually. I think tracking should be illegal. But I don’t live in a fantasy world. My point was that in our real world, where everything already tracks me, who cares?

I do. I'm not a secretive person (in fact, should we meet down the pub, I'll probably tell you way more about me than you want to know), but I am a private person. That is to say that I don't hide who I am or what I do/say/think, but I want it to be my choice as to whom I share such information.

Or, to be more concise: My business is my business, not anyone else's.

Pervasive tracking is incredibly annoying. And while I do some things to protect my privacy (custom android roms, ad/tracker blockers, both local and network-based, disable GPS/location services on my phone, aggressively manage cookies and a raft of other things I either do or don't do to minimize leakage of my life), I have to put up with some tracking (my cellular provider needs to track my phone or they can't connect calls, deliver data, etc.) because I'm not interested in squatting in a lean-to out in the woods somewhere.

But that doesn't mean I have to like it or, more to your point, not care about it.

Edit: Clarified prose.

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#73

Post by TacticalCoder »

AlotOfReading wrote: post #27
bnjmn wrote: post #7

Are there any new cars / car brands that credibly promise not to track their drivers? Any car with a network connection for software updates seems likely to be harvesting driver data, or is at least capable of doing so.

Essentially, no. Your best bets are the German manufacturers, some of whom (e.g. Porsche) have data opt outs for all services and exist within a legislative framework that's at least mildly protective of consumer privacy. Even then you should be wary about cars built for export to other markets like the US. It's common for the regional manufacturer to be a separate legal entity, with separate backend services, delive…

> Your best bets are the German manufacturers, some of whom (e.g. Porsche) have data opt outs for all services and exist within a legislative framework

Funnily enough that car in white at the center of the picture in the WIRED article is a Porsche (the most luxurious and less sold of all the Porsche models: the Panamera).

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#74

Post by blueridge »

xadhominemx wrote: post #59
blueridge wrote: post #2

https://archive.is/9IU8W I've got an old (2002) car, I love the buttons and knobs. No cameras, no screens, no key fob, no voice control, no electronic "safety" features, no tracking. The 4L straight six engine is still going strong at almost 300,000 miles. What's funny is watching my friends attempt to back out of the driveway or parking lot without a camera and screen. They put it in reverse and their eyes go right…

Why would you you “safety” features in quotes?

I'm talking about things like: eyesight assists, automatic braking, side view mirrors that flash and light up constantly, etc. My wife has a new car with all of these features, and they're incredibly distracting. The car brakes automatically in parking lots when it sees shadows, beeps endlessly anytime it sees a curb while in reverse, and alarms anytime she so much as scratches her eye while driving because the software decided she's distracted or her eyes aren't on the road.

I know a lot of people have different experiences with this stuff, and I'm sure the features have saved asses a few times, but she can't stand it. And for me, when the car is constantly alarming, and I have to constantly look at the screen to figure out why, it makes me hesitate while driving and I feel less confident on the road.

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#75

Post by HybridCurve »

foobarbecue wrote: post #11
blueridge wrote: post #2

https://archive.is/9IU8W I've got an old (2002) car, I love the buttons and knobs. No cameras, no screens, no key fob, no voice control, no electronic "safety" features, no tracking. The 4L straight six engine is still going strong at almost 300,000 miles. What's funny is watching my friends attempt to back out of the driveway or parking lot without a camera and screen. They put it in reverse and their eyes go right…

Do you know if your 2002 has side-impact anti-intrusion bars in the doors? I loved my 1999 Isuzu Amigo, and was sad when I was rear-ended in 2017 and had to get rid of it, but that fender bender probably saved my life. I replaced the Amigo with a 2014 Outlander Sport and in 2019 I was t-boned at an intersection, with the other car driving directly into my driver's side door. I was amazed to find that I escaped withou…

This was my take when people suggest older cars as an alternative. Safety has improved dramatically in the past 20-30 years, especially with side impacts where fatalities or serious injury can be common. It's one of the few reservations I have when driving my '91 BMW.

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#76

Post by [deleted] »

voz_ wrote: post #22
tashoecraft wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s great for you, but there’s been amazing advances in the world of automobile safety in the past 20 years. I’d rather improve my safety chances in an accident than worry about “tracking”.

Agreed. I don’t understand the privacy obsession at the cost of all other comforts and features.

[deleted]

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#77

Post by endemic »

xadhominemx wrote: post #54
public_defender wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a false choice. There is no reason that safety would require commercial surveillance. Also, why did you put the word tracking in quotation marks?

They put it in quotes because no one is using these data to follow any individual’s life or movements. These days are all aggregated and/or anonymized before any detailed analysis.

Then it should be no big deal for a few concerned folks to opt out.

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#78

Post by Tarball10 »

orwin wrote: post #57
karlshea wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just isn't true. There are many cars where it's impossible from within the car to see certain places behind it without the rear camera, no matter how your mirrors are set.

If you have a HGV or a bus, i understand why you would need a rearview camera. Or with an utility vehicle with high or now windows. I doubt that's what OP is driving though, i would guess he has a normal car and does not need to do heavy duty. When i'm driving my father's utility vehicle, i can only use my side mirrors, so i'm extra careful, but with any normal car i ever drove, even large one like a Xantia, i don't…

All vehicles have rear blind spots when it comes to short objects (i.e. children), with SUVs and pickups being significantly worse than standard cars.

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2012/03/the-danger-of-bl...

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#79

Post by blueridge »

HybridCurve wrote: post #75
foobarbecue wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know if your 2002 has side-impact anti-intrusion bars in the doors? I loved my 1999 Isuzu Amigo, and was sad when I was rear-ended in 2017 and had to get rid of it, but that fender bender probably saved my life. I replaced the Amigo with a 2014 Outlander Sport and in 2019 I was t-boned at an intersection, with the other car driving directly into my driver's side door. I was amazed to find that I escaped withou…

This was my take when people suggest older cars as an alternative. Safety has improved dramatically in the past 20-30 years, especially with side impacts where fatalities or serious injury can be common. It's one of the few reservations I have when driving my '91 BMW.

Yeah, this resonates. I don't need maximum comfort in my vehicle, and I don't think the electronic and technology features are necessary. But I do think about safety and I do have reservations when driving, depending on where I'm going and how I need to drive to get there. I do know that if I was t-boned I'd be toast, and I often think about buying a new car just for the upgrades with airbags, materials, construction, etc. But the joy of driving the car, the familiarity and feel of the car on the road in all weather, the intuition behind the wheel...I just really love it.

Re: How the most popular cars in the US track drivers

#80

Post by MisterTea »

hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #53

It’s becoming impossible to practice what you preach when it comes to data privacy. ‘Don’t like it, don’t buy it’ is difficult to execute unless you don’t mind not having a car, mobile phone, tv, browse the internet or even go out in a public place. There needs to be regulation and at least the ability to at least easily opt out of any of this insanity, but until there’s one (or probably many) widespread data-breache…

Remeber the uproar over cameras on phones? Then the fury over a person bringing a google glass into a bathroom. Now people film themselves in the bathroom.

No one cares as we live in a very connected world where privacy is almost gone - in fact many people like broadcasting themselves. (To add - I don't like nor endorse it - "computas shoulda stayed hard!" is my motto. But that is reality. Hell, my friends kids ape youtubers and they're just 6 or 7 years old. I find it gross they find it cute. go figure. poh-tay-toe poh-toh-toe)

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