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The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

novehiclesinthepark.com

911–920 of 1001 posts

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#911

I found the term 'wagon' to be unclear. In the UK, this would be something akin to an articulated lorry, although I am familiar with the American term 'station wagon' so I took it to mean a type of motor car at the very least. Presumably that is not the case, having now seen the results. Is it a sort of unpowered trolley?

More like a little red cart on wheels pulled on a handle.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#912

I found the term 'wagon' to be unclear. In the UK, this would be something akin to an articulated lorry, although I am familiar with the American term 'station wagon' so I took it to mean a type of motor car at the very least. Presumably that is not the case, having now seen the results. Is it a sort of unpowered trolley?

I read it as the "little red wagon" type.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#913
post #149

To me, if I see a rule trying to ban "vehicles" without defining "vehicles", I take my concept of "vehicles" by deduction: I think about all the ways that things that I know of as being "vehicle-esque" could be problematic in various different ways such that you'd want to ban them — being loud; having a lot of inertial momentum when colliding with pedestrians; littering (the horse example); property damage (skateboar…

To put it more succinctly: the sign itself isn't the statute or bylaw! it's just a quick reminder.

Everyone is trying to interpret one line of text. But that line ks just a stand in for a much longer text that should answer all of the questions.

E.g. for emergency vehicles, there is certainly a statute somewhere that grants them exemption, if that is appropriate. We don't need to torture ourself wondering.

The sibling who mentioned his recombinant bicycle not fitting the intent of the bylaws should petition the relevant authority to update the text to clarify this detail. But that doesn't mean they're going to change the signs or graphics.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#914

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you look up the definition of "highway", or are you substituting your own? It's in there.

> highway "includes every road, street, lane or right of way designed or intended for or used by the general public for the passage of vehicles" By definition, a park where vehicles are forbidden is not a highway. Please don't act smarter than you are.

A park where vehicles are not forbidden also might not have any highways. Vehicles are defined in terms of being capable of transport on highways, but there are vehicles used off highways.

Just because the definition of vehicles refers to highways doesn't mean the definition is not relevant in a situation in which there are no highways.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#915
post #548

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Once you stop using moderation to implicitly endorse speech you aren't as responsible for anything that is said. This is the entire point of section 230. Are you suggesting that section 230 is meant to discourage Internet intermediaries from moderation? The original intent of this law was to stop requiring intermediaries to choose between adopting a passive conduit role and having legal responsibility for content.…

If you take moderation far enough you become a publisher

That's not true. As far as the law is concerned, users/providers are shielded so long as they don't take part in authorship. You be as despotic or biased as you want, and you're still not considered the publisher of content provided by another user/provider.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#916

I'm fascinated by the fact that my takeaway is the precise opposite of what the author intended. To me, the answer to all of the questions was crystal-clear. Yes, you can academically wonder whether an orbiting space station is a vehicle and whether it's in the park, but the obvious intent of the sign couldn't be clearer. Cars/trucks/motorcycles aren't allowed, and obviously police and ambulances (and fire trucks) do…

> obviously police and ambulances (and fire trucks) doing their jobs don't have to follow the sign.

Nope, not for me :-) But funny part is that it's so obvious for me, I'm surprised anyone else thinks otherwise.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#917
post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Now you're assuming the intent. That's true but without assuming intent you end up blindly following rules. Something struck me when first moved to UK from Turkey: Every rule in UK seemed to have an intent and that's why I think Turkey is full of rules which no one follows but in UK the rules are less numerous but followed. In Turkey, Turks like to think that the rules are not followed because the fines are too smal…

Defining rules based on intent works when there’s less corruption. Otherwise the rule will be vague enough to extract a bribe or a blackmail by the enforcing authority. Once corruption is under control you can have things like prosecutorial discretion. On the other hand, having so many rules that no one can reasonably know, understand and follow will also lead to bribes and extortion by law enforcement if corruption…

Well, I had similar thoughts. I am reading the comments about laws and rules here and I am thinking: You people have never been in Kazakhstan or Azerbaijan.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#918

I'm fascinated by the fact that my takeaway is the precise opposite of what the author intended. To me, the answer to all of the questions was crystal-clear. Yes, you can academically wonder whether an orbiting space station is a vehicle and whether it's in the park, but the obvious intent of the sign couldn't be clearer. Cars/trucks/motorcycles aren't allowed, and obviously police and ambulances (and fire trucks) do…

While I agree, I marked the emergency vehicles as being in violation of the rule. My interpretation being that such a rule would not be enforced even though it was technically violated.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#919
post #646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's true but without assuming intent you end up blindly following rules. Right but overly generic rules make that worse. And overly specific make a lot of work and allow stuff to still go thru cracks. It's hard problem to make following rules with intent but without rule-enforcers using it for their own whims > Something struck me when first moved to UK from Turkey: Every rule in UK seemed to have an intent and…

That sounds fantastic actually fighting everyday bribery is such a nice feeling. I spent some time in a country with corrupt officers it was a real life drain for me, it was why I could not live abroad. The Wikipedia article is a little bit light on the bribery aspect, but there seems to have been considerable efforts made before 2012. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_in_Poland

If you look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index you can also notice how post-soviet countries that keep close ties with russia also still rank high on that. I wonder how much of that is from same kind of people keeping power, or russian influence.

Re: The rule says, “No vehicles in the park”

#920
All the discussions over interpretation are missing the point of the exercise, which is to show how hard it is to find agreement over something as emotionally neutral as "is the vehicle in the park".

Communication and interpretation is hard. This is a blind spot for many techies, who think there are "right answers".

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