$900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI • Hacker News Board

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#121

Post by dumbaccount123 » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:00 PM UTC

BrandoElFollito wrote: post #97

giantg2 wrote: post #12

It's always interesting to think about how someone somewhere is earning as much as you earn in a decade or lifetime in a single year. Also that you are that person for someone else.

This is a good point. I look at 900k$ and think wow from the perspective of my very well paid job in France. Getting 900k$ a year would bring great things to me and probably make me retire earlier. This will not be life-changing though. And then I think about people who earn 5% of what I do and for them multiplying their income by two would probably be truly life changing for them. And then these 900k$ do not look th…

Are you here to just brag? Also the dollar sign goes on the other side.

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#122

Post by scarface_74 » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:00 PM UTC

wmf wrote: post #104

scarface_74 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s completely different. I can sell my RSUs in AMZN as soon as they vest on the public market at market price.

For pre-IPO companies you have things like SecondMarket.

Only if your company allows you to sell your shares and only if you work for a company where there is and interest and even then you’re going to be required to sell at a discount.

I know exactly how much my shares are worth on my spreadsheet -

=GOOGLEFINANCE("AMZN", "price") * number of shares

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#123

Post by hinkley » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:01 PM UTC

m3kw9 wrote: post #45

You better perform with that pay

There’s been a couple times in my career where my income needs were low enough that for one more raise I could afford to hire an assistant. For that kind of money I could hire several. And an apprentice.

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#124

Post by scarface_74 » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:02 PM UTC

gambiting wrote: post #90

scarface_74 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I can’t use “the pay” to exchange for goods and services when I earn it, it’s not “pay”

Obviously wrong - a company car or a gym membership plan are part of your pay even though you can't use either to pay for goods and services

And I’m still trading labor for compensation that I’m exchanging for goods and services.

What type of goods and services can I exchange for illiquid equity or profit sharing that may or may not come years later?

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#125

Post by WinLychee » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:02 PM UTC

biztos wrote: post #49

jdm2212 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Paying someone a lot doesn't magically make them a good engineer. You have to actually hire the best people, and there's only so many of them to go around.

I'm sympathetic to this argument, because I know both low-quality and high-quality engineers at most FAANGs, but in principle isn't offering a lot of money a good way to attract talent? In the case of OpenAI you also have interesting tech and a brand that will massively accelerate your career if you want to stay in that field. So while yeah, you have to hire the best people; and OpenAI like everyone else will be payi…

Sort of, you will probably attract the best talent by having the hardest problems, fostering a culture of bottom-up innovation, and giving your engineers a lot of freedom rather than micro-managing them. The pay is closely related, but you also get a lot of people trying to game the system and optimize for max pay, without necessarily the skill or creativity you're looking for. Said another way: top pay attracts people looking for top pay, for better or worse. There's probably a strong correlation between "best" people and high pay, but it's also hard to quantify "best".

How do you quantify best? Number of degrees? Publications? Association with prestigious institutions? Past work experience at top companies? Speed of problem solving? All of this is gameable once it starts being _measured_ and enough incentives exist for people to devote their life to winning the "game".

However, if you happen to hire a math olympiad winning PhD with numerous publications from a tier-1 research institution with a known track record in industry, it would be hard to argue they aren't the best. But success breeds success, and top people will keep being poached to other top places. Kinda how money makes more money.

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#126

Post by lotsofpulp » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:02 PM UTC

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #111

lotsofpulp wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not find that interesting. If the goal is wealth redistribution, then either a marginal income/wealth (property)/sales tax accomplishes that. We do not have marginal sales tax rates because it is not feasible. Marginal income tax is feasible, and so it does exist in most places. Marginal property/wealth tax is somewhere in the middle, given the difficulties in valuing thinly traded assets, and the tremendous eff…

Does anywhere in the world have a marginal property tax? LA introduced a mansion sales tax. Anywhere else? My main issue with a marginal property tax is that the areas with high property values already have enough taxes generally for the things property tax covers. Not sure at least in the US how feasible it would be to have a marginal property tax and the revenue go to the state and the Fed (or even the county's gen…

>My main issue with a marginal property tax is that the areas with high property values already have enough taxes generally for the things property tax covers.

The big issue in my opinion is defining property/wealth (not just land and cars, but also intellectual property, art, etc), and then the feasibility of appraising all of that, and then litigating those appraisals (for the populace as a whole).

Seems like it could get into quite a bit of the country’s resources going to refereeing the game, which at some point takes away from productivity.

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#127

Post by sebzim4500 » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:03 PM UTC

sylware wrote: post #106

This is excessive. It is high-school level (in the worst case scenario 1 or 2 college/uni years). Yeah, a bit higher than the minimum wage. It seems to be inflated wages not based on skills but on technical fashion trends. Mafia?

I am very confused by your comment. Are you claiming that $900k median compensation is only a bit higher than minimum wage?

Or are you claiming that some of the smartest AI researchers in the world are only slightly more qualified than the average high-schooler?

Either claim is roughly equally absurd.

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#128

Post by sebzim4500 » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:04 PM UTC

Trasmatta wrote: post #21

Looks like they don't hire remote, otherwise I would absolutely be applying right now...no way am I moving to SF. (Not that I think I would have a realistic chance, since I'm sure they're getting the best of the best applicants right now. But still.)

They do hire remote in some cases, but normally only for up to a year and only if it's someone they really want. They hope that the person will be willing to move after working there for a year, I guess.

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#129

Post by sebzim4500 » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:05 PM UTC

scarface_74 wrote: post #76

$600K of that is “equity” in a private company. You never know when the company will go public or with what valuation. I can’t sell equity in a private company to exchange for goods and services like I can stock that gets deposited in my brokerage account every six months.

You can absolutely sell the PPUs in OpenAI, you will not struggle to find a buyer.

Re: $900k Median Package for Engineers at OpenAI

#130

Post by Solvency » Sat, Jun 24, 2023, 6:05 PM UTC

gambiting wrote: post #94

Solvency wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I find more interesting is this: A sole proprietor landscaper making $45-50K a year in California is paying $675 a year in annual registration fees just to keep his newish pickup truck on the road. Why newish? Because the people he's servicing trust a guy with a nicer work vehicle than a beaten down 30 year old Tacoma. A $900k developer with the same pickup is also paying $675 a year. Extrapolate this seemingly…

I don't understand your point - is it that people should pay different amount for identical amount of work based on how much they themselves are paid?

Vehicle registration fees, like many others, are 100% a blunt money collection mechanism imposed by the government. This has nothing to do with a poor or wealthy person buying a new Playstation 5.