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Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

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Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#91

Post by jacquesm »

routerl wrote: post #67
InCityDreams wrote: post #52

Does this qualify for a Darwin award?

Yesterday, people involved with the Darwin awards were saying "let's wait 24 hours". For the pilot and co-founder, yes, he deserves the award. For the passengers, I predict lawsuits. But apparently the contract included a clause about accidental death. The guy who brought his son also probably deserves a Darwin award.

This is not an accident though, this is gross negligence and I somewhat doubt you can contract your way out of that.

An accident is when something unexpectedly goes wrong. This end result was baked into the design and it was merely a question of how many times you could cycle that hull before it would implode, not if it would. Death lottery.

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#92

Post by jamiek88 »

f38zf5vdt wrote: post #63
saberdancer wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their bodies are also pressurized at 1 atms, after being exposed to 400 atms they instantly died. My guess is that they were effectively vaporized/liquified. Much better way to go then suffocate in darkness.

Probably combusted? At 400 atms their biomass would compress into a gelatinous hydrocarbon fat blob with the oxygen present, resulting in automatic combustion. The amount of compression their bodies would experience is an order of magnitude greater than a diesel engine cylinder. The explosion would immediately be quenched by the surrounding water and the only thing remaining of the occupants would be ash. This would…

When it happened in that accident referred to elsewhere in the thread the water temp was elevated massively in that area (enclosed so measurable).

Their blood would combust instantly.

They found cooked blood after that accident too.

Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byford_Dolphin

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#93

Post by LordHeini »

rightbyte wrote: post #45
saberdancer wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their bodies are also pressurized at 1 atms, after being exposed to 400 atms they instantly died. My guess is that they were effectively vaporized/liquified. Much better way to go then suffocate in darkness.

Why are people assuming this? How about a leak that fills the sub with water? Is a leak impossible to keep stable at those depths?

It depends on the depth.

But if the leak is noticed at say 20m they would have surfaced.

A leak with the amount of pressure at 1000m would cause a high speed jet like from a water cutter. That in turn would cause the material around the leak to be ground away.

This is really bad for the structural integrity and boom the whole thing implodes in a fraction of a second.

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#94

Post by ilyt »

getmeinrn wrote: post #75

Something I've learned over my life is not to automatically trust that someone has done or will do the right thing just because they stick their neck out. Sometimes they stick their neck out because they don't actually understand the risks and consequences, but they are pretending that they do. They're artificially signaling confidence. In this case, the CEO risking his life on this third(!) voyage means 1 of 2 possi…

> Sometimes they stick their neck out because they don't actually understand the risks and consequences, but they are pretending that they do.

Or they are just adrenaline junkies with far smaller risk threshold than typical human.

In general there was a ton of red flags but as probably nobody gets to that level of money without ability to sell the stuff they are pedding, he probably sold the fact the submarine has successfully dived so it is "tested".

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#95

Post by masklinn »

TheCaptain4815 wrote: post #13

If the sub imploded shortly after reaching the titanic, how exactly did the people on board die? Was it an instant pressurized death? Do they drown or something?

No time to drown, when the pressure vessel failed they basically found themselves in a hydraulic press. The entire thing would have imploded as the pressure inside the vessel went from 1 to 400atm.

Instantly too, as carbon fibre is brittle, this would not have been a progressive process.

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#96

Post by jacquesm »

kfrzcode wrote: post #87
masklinn wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The ocean is very, very deep. The Titanic is "relatively" shallow, only 3800 feet below sea level It's 3800 meters , 13000 feet as you wrote in the first paragraph. Nothing shallow about 3800m deep, that's abyssal plains level, it's basically the bottom of the "normal" ocean (the abnormal ocean being the hadal zone of the trenches). It's a land of no light, little to no oxygen, and literally freezing cold.

Something about this comment is terrifying even beyond the story itself. I'll stay a dry land lubber

Space is safer. I'd fly to the ISS and back long before you could get me into something like this.

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#97

Post by RajT88 »

WORMS_EAT_WORMS wrote: post #90

Almost as interesting as this story has been the comments online. Everyone, everywhere just parroting and re-parroting the same comments, attitude, pretending to understand the engineering with snippets from comments they’ve read, reactive talking points, etc… Very strange. Did anyone else feel like an alien following this story online?

Welcome to the internet!

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#98

Post by aidenn0 »

rightbyte wrote: post #45
saberdancer wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their bodies are also pressurized at 1 atms, after being exposed to 400 atms they instantly died. My guess is that they were effectively vaporized/liquified. Much better way to go then suffocate in darkness.

Why are people assuming this? How about a leak that fills the sub with water? Is a leak impossible to keep stable at those depths?

At 5800PSI, A leak with an area of 1/100th of a square inch would have 58 pounds of force behind the water coming in and a flow rate of about a half-a-gallon per second.

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#99

Post by routerl »

jacquesm wrote: post #91
routerl wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday, people involved with the Darwin awards were saying "let's wait 24 hours". For the pilot and co-founder, yes, he deserves the award. For the passengers, I predict lawsuits. But apparently the contract included a clause about accidental death. The guy who brought his son also probably deserves a Darwin award.

This is not an accident though, this is gross negligence and I somewhat doubt you can contract your way out of that. An accident is when something unexpectedly goes wrong. This end result was baked into the design and it was merely a question of how many times you could cycle that hull before it would implode, not if it would. Death lottery.

I think you're right. There are proven ways to do this without the fatal result, and this company ignored many of the industry best practices. I look forward to seeing this play out in court, because it has the potential to create a really good precedent.

Re: Oceangate Statement, “We now believe that [all crew] have sadly been lost.”

#100

Post by ilyt »

phire wrote: post #83
jonah wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the press-conference they said both end bells were found separately - no mention of whether the window was still intact. It'll be interesting to see the failure analysis. [Edit] Link to video with a description of the major debris found: https://youtu.be/A0xJ220Fod4?t=263 "the front end-bell of the pressure hull - that was the first indication that there was a catastrophic event" "the aft end-bell which basically.…

That suggests it was the carbon fibre shell that failed. If it was the Plexiglas that failed (or other part of the end bell assembly), I'd expect the pressure to quickly equalise though the failure point and the carbon fibre shell to remain relatively intact and hold those end bells together. Though, I'm not an engineer. Maybe the rapid change in loading could result in the carbon fibre shattering.

400 atmospheres. I doubt it would be gentle thru any material. That's only order of magnitude off water jet cutter
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