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Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

arstechnica.com

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Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#591

Post by RajT88 »

bigmattystyles wrote: post #144
vlod wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The alternative is death of 134 odd people. Not ideal. :/ I would expect some e2e encryption satellite communication, however that might be still traceable to the enemy listening posts. Man, I now need to watch "Hunt for Red October" again [0]. lol [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3C2tE7vjdHk

"1 ping only" -Russian sub captain with Scottish accent for some reason. It's still one of my favorite movies though.

Far from the most egregious accent offenses committed by Connery.

There's so many, it's hard to pick!

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#592

Post by dharmab »

vanattab wrote: post #503
topspin wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> since it’s extremely well tested Logitech tests products under these conditions? Sea water? I've had considerable experience with Logitech products and I can't imagine employing a consumer grade Logitech controller for any life-critical purpose. It's built-to-a-price e-waste from which you hope to get a couple years of service under near ideal indoor residential conditions.

For what it's worth us nuclear subs use cots game controllers for periscope control. It has other benefits to like being super intuitive for new young soldiers to use.

They use the Microsoft controllers which have literally 7 digit R&D budgets, and have non-gaming use cases in mind. Not cheap off brand Logitech controllers.

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#593

Post by rgmerk »

brutusborn wrote: post #404
reaperman wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s a difference between Jacques Cousteau building a janky submarine rig for himself vs. Creating a business model of selling tickets to random strangers on that janky submarine.

There is definitely a difference, but it doesn’t really matter philosophically speaking. If people want to take huge risks, then so be it. Whether they build the sub themselves or pay and give that responsibility to a proxy, it is still up to them to make their own risk assessment.

That’s not how regulation of transportation works.

You can build your own plane and fly it with relatively few restrictions, but as soon as you a) manufacture a plane for sale to someone else, or b) get paid for transporting someone in it, the regulators become much much stricter.

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#594

Post by dharmab »

thehappypm wrote: post #552
Karupan wrote: post #165

According to the NYTimes, OceanGate refused to undergo any sort of external audit/certification process [0]. I would imagine using an off the shelf, cheap controller would have been one of the first things to be flagged. Makes you wonder how many other critical components did they skimp on [0] https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/06/20/us/titanic-missing-s...

Why would off the shelf be considered a bad thing? If you’re an engineer, finding a reliable part from a supplier that meets your spec is an amazing thing. Intel processors are off the shelf, as are 555 timers, screws, literally everything. Not every field is like computer science where “isEven” has a library that makes sense to avoid

It's less than it's off the shelf and more that it's the cheap brand your mom might buy your little brother as a second controller because it's half the price of the first-party one.

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#596

Post by k_roy »

dudeinjapan wrote: post #573
rwmj wrote: post #46

There's a BBC documentary from last year which I just watched: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0fpz9zw and honestly a lot of it seems quite amateur hour. One of the steering motors was fitted backwards. When they discovered this, at the bottom of the ocean and a few hundred feet from Titanic, the solution they used was to hold the gamepad at right angles to compensate. That time they proceeded with the tour and mad…

> One of the steering motors was fitted backwards… the solution they used was to hold the gamepad at right angles to compensate. Sounds like everything I’ve built in Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom so far.

I hate that I feel this comment in my soul

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#597

Post by iancmceachern »

srmarm wrote: post #3

The US Navy uses an Xbox 360 controller in active service [0] Mass market has a lot of R&D to leverage so it makes sense. Nothing to say this is the cause of the fault and probably going to be more reliable than something hand rolled. [0] https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/19/16333376/us-navy-military...

Yes, but interesting they don't use it to drive the sub, or for other mission or life critical tasks... in this sub they did seemingly

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#598

Post by HWR_14 »

delecti wrote: post #295
HWR_14 wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was a decompression event with high pressure air flowing out. If a submarine has a rupture that deep, it would go the other way, high pressure water coming in. Most likely, as soon as there was any break the whole thing would collapse in on itself. Picture yourself crushing an empty coke can between the two flat ends. It goes from intact and pretty strong to all of a sudden easy to push and crushed. In the event…

Keeping it to round numbers, pressure at 4000m is about 400atm, or a bit under 6000 PSI. From what I can see, a waterjet cutter ranges from 20,000 PSI to 100,000, depending on model and which source you trust. So if they could contain it to a pinhole, they'd probably be lucky enough that the incoming stream wouldn't cut through the far side, though the same isn't true of the occupants. Though as you said, the far mor…

Thanks for the rough numbers. And yes, that would be enough to kill people, but I probably overstated the effect on harder materials.

A pressure washer maxes out around 4000 PSI for a powerful one, and that can easily cut through flesh.

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#599

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

dudeinjapan wrote: post #573
rwmj wrote: post #46

There's a BBC documentary from last year which I just watched: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0fpz9zw and honestly a lot of it seems quite amateur hour. One of the steering motors was fitted backwards. When they discovered this, at the bottom of the ocean and a few hundred feet from Titanic, the solution they used was to hold the gamepad at right angles to compensate. That time they proceeded with the tour and mad…

> One of the steering motors was fitted backwards… the solution they used was to hold the gamepad at right angles to compensate. Sounds like everything I’ve built in Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom so far.

“Man this thing steers like garbage… oh wait… duh”

Re: Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

#600

Post by MagicMoonlight »

proggy wrote: post #200
rwmj wrote: post #46

There's a BBC documentary from last year which I just watched: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0fpz9zw and honestly a lot of it seems quite amateur hour. One of the steering motors was fitted backwards. When they discovered this, at the bottom of the ocean and a few hundred feet from Titanic, the solution they used was to hold the gamepad at right angles to compensate. That time they proceeded with the tour and mad…

It is simply unbelievable that the company was even able to get to the point of diving to such depths with humans aboard. If they had encountered a program-destroying but non-catastrophic failure earlier on, it is possible we wouldn't be looking at one of the many horrific outcomes that this incident will likely resolve to. Looking at the accounts reported to date, the OceanGate engineering culture was basically non-…

I am so glad the CEO is on board. Normally they’d just be able to get away scott free with billions and tell everyone how sorry they are.
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