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IKEA-Oriented Development

taylor.town

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Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#41

Post by rootusrootus »

euroderf wrote: post #6

Another lesson of Ikea is that often you cannot move them from one home/apartment to another, because if you try to take it apart and then reassemble it, it's never the same. To extend this via analogy to the software realm, a deep refactoring is problematic whereas OTOH a complete rewrite is a better idea. Which has not borne borne out by industry experience.

My most recent lesson of IKEA is that quality has gone to shit. And prices are pretty high, all considered. Bought a couple new Hemnes dressers a few months back and they are just garbage compared to the older stuff. Material quality is same as usual, but the precision of manufacturing is gone. In the end, only one or two drawers actually open correctly. The rest bind up to varying degrees. I'm tempted to partially disassemble them and rebuild with my own hardware and glue in order to get tolerances that are adequate.

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#42

Post by rootusrootus »

avgDev wrote: post #24
amemisoglu wrote: post #5

From "quality" perspective, don't imitiate Ikea :)

This is silly. I love Ikea stuff. I bought an Ikea kitchen, nobody else will give you a 15 year warranty. I have read stories of kitchens being completely replaced because Ikea no longer made a certain design. If the cheaper furniture lasts me 10 years, I will most likely be ready to replace it anyway, as my taste changes. I guess if you are going for a certain historic style and plan on keeping it that way forever t…

> This is silly

It is on point, in my experience. We've bought various pieces of IKEA furniture over the last 15 years, and the stuff they're building in the last couple years is atrocious. And it's not even that cheap. I'm done buying their furniture, I can get cheap crap from China with similar tolerances for less money.

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#43

Post by pphysch »

voz_ wrote: post #23
euroderf wrote: post #6

Another lesson of Ikea is that often you cannot move them from one home/apartment to another, because if you try to take it apart and then reassemble it, it's never the same. To extend this via analogy to the software realm, a deep refactoring is problematic whereas OTOH a complete rewrite is a better idea. Which has not borne borne out by industry experience.

A rewrite is almost never the right choice.

I much prefer a SWE culture that embraces iterative development, where "rewrites" and migrations are not feared and can be done safely and efficiently because care was taken during the design process to identify ontologies and system boundaries. Yes, the MVP takes a bit longer as a result.

If you don't iterate, and you push what is essentially v0.1.0 to production, you reinforce a culture where deleting code is sin and the concept of iteration ("rewriting") is foreign.

http://www.laputan.org/mud/

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#44

Post by rootusrootus »

amemisoglu wrote: post #5

From "quality" perspective, don't imitiate Ikea :)

Agreed. Their stuff used to be alright -- cheap materials, but good precision. You don't buy it to last decades, and that's okay because it's inexpensive. But lately it's really gone to hell. Same cheap materials, but the precision of manufacturing is gone. We've been disappointed in the stuff we've purchased in the last year or so, and we've been happy IKEA customers for 15 years. Not any more.

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#46

Post by ukuina »

rootusrootus wrote: post #41
euroderf wrote: post #6

Another lesson of Ikea is that often you cannot move them from one home/apartment to another, because if you try to take it apart and then reassemble it, it's never the same. To extend this via analogy to the software realm, a deep refactoring is problematic whereas OTOH a complete rewrite is a better idea. Which has not borne borne out by industry experience.

My most recent lesson of IKEA is that quality has gone to shit. And prices are pretty high, all considered. Bought a couple new Hemnes dressers a few months back and they are just garbage compared to the older stuff. Material quality is same as usual, but the precision of manufacturing is gone. In the end, only one or two drawers actually open correctly. The rest bind up to varying degrees. I'm tempted to partially d…

They have also replaced previously metal joints and screws with wooden pieces.

I had to bolster my chest of drawers with additional wooden center beams to prevent it from bowing from evenly distributed weight.

Oddly, there were already provisions for these additional beams, leading me to believe the design was "simplified" on the way to manufacturing.

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#47

Post by Swizec »

hef19898 wrote: post #17
belval wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally I have had trouble reconciling this seemingly prevalent "you can't disassemble Ikea furniture" with my own experience. It's not made for it sure but bookshelves, bed frames and tables can all be reassembled reasonably well. Anything smaller you can just put in the truck when moving.

Again one of those impossible to kill memes, along with bad mounting instructions (they are on par with Lego, and way better than a lot of industry ones). Usually tells you more about the person making that point than about the point they try to make.

> along with bad mounting instructions (they are on par with Lego, and way better than a lot of industry ones

After reading Visual Thinking, I think this is a different brains problem. Some people just aren’t able to object visualize and need written step by step instructions.

We tested this with my girlfriend using a LEGO set. In the time I blazed through 5 bags of Lego, she barely managed to get 1 assembled. Because she just struggles with visual instruction and manipulating objects in her mind.

The opposite happens with sequential written instructions. I struggle to follow simple recipes without pictures and have to re-read the same step multiple times to get what they’re saying, whereas she can blaze through no problem and doesn’t understand why I’m struggling.

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#48

Post by makapuf »

pphysch wrote: post #43
voz_ wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A rewrite is almost never the right choice.

I much prefer a SWE culture that embraces iterative development, where "rewrites" and migrations are not feared and can be done safely and efficiently because care was taken during the design process to identify ontologies and system boundaries. Yes, the MVP takes a bit longer as a result. If you don't iterate, and you push what is essentially v0.1.0 to production, you reinforce a culture where deleting code is sin a…

I think of it as: a whole rewrite is never the answer so don't start one, a gradual one always is, so plan for it.

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#49

Post by pimlottc »

surprisetalk wrote: post #2

Author here! Thanks for sharing :)

Minor bit of feedback: it's kind of confusing, for the first bullet, that the image shown is an example of what NOT to do. Most people would assume that's a pic of IKEA packaging, when it's actually Amazon. You should add a caption to make it clearer.

Re: IKEA-Oriented Development

#50

Post by agloe_dreams »

alex3305 wrote: post #15
amemisoglu wrote: post #5

From "quality" perspective, don't imitiate Ikea :)

I get where you are coming from, but why not? What IKEA produces for the price is seriously impressive. Also why would you need particle board or MDF when filling furniture with cardboard is way cheaper and mostly fits the bill. However, I think that we as software developers are more like hand crafted furniture makers. And that there is WYSIWYG (like Squarespace) for the masses. And IMHO there is nothing wrong with…

I would argue the LACK table is the textbook definition of a good MVP. Minimal, light, affordable, functional. Granted, I remember when it was $7.99, but the point stands.
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