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Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

theaviationgeekclub.com

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Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#61

Post by mcpackieh »

nwallin wrote: post #42

Does any know any more details about this? It's a fun tidbit that gets a link/article on social media every few weeks, but it's never anything more than a tidbit. "The US needed titanium for the SR-71. The only supplier of titanium was the Soviet Union. So the US bought it from the Soviet Union through a shell corporation." But that's it. It's those 3 facts and only those three facts expressed in anywhere between one…

Of related interest, here is an old CIA.gov webpage giving an account (from the CIA, keep in mind..) of the United States' realization that the Soviet Union was building the Alfa class of submarine with titanium hulls, which many people believed wasn't possible for various reasons (the difficulty of shaping and welding huge pieces of titanium in dirty shipyards, titanium alloys supposedly dissolving in sea water, etc): https://web.archive.org/web/20080919231406/https://www.cia.g...

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#62

Post by numpad0 »

tokai wrote: post #52
nwallin wrote: post #42

Does any know any more details about this? It's a fun tidbit that gets a link/article on social media every few weeks, but it's never anything more than a tidbit. "The US needed titanium for the SR-71. The only supplier of titanium was the Soviet Union. So the US bought it from the Soviet Union through a shell corporation." But that's it. It's those 3 facts and only those three facts expressed in anywhere between one…

As I understand it Soviet material science was ahead of everyone when it came to titanium alloys in the 60s. Both in the compositions of alloys and in the production of alloys with precise heat treatment. I guess the US just wanted the best materials.

The problem isn’t that the story is suspicious, but that only the cached thumbnail version is around, and we can’t make out the letters on the mug.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#63

Post by aardvark179 »

nwallin wrote: post #42

Does any know any more details about this? It's a fun tidbit that gets a link/article on social media every few weeks, but it's never anything more than a tidbit. "The US needed titanium for the SR-71. The only supplier of titanium was the Soviet Union. So the US bought it from the Soviet Union through a shell corporation." But that's it. It's those 3 facts and only those three facts expressed in anywhere between one…

I agree there probably is an interesting story, but it’s also worth noting the things that weren’t true back in the 60s. I found some old declassified CIA reports that suggest the USSR controlled 70% of world titanium production, and that this was five times US production. Patents for the processes used in Australian production appear to date from 1960 onwards, and there is also a note that 80% of the titanium bought for these aircraft was rejected due to impurities.

Putting all those things together I would guess that they could not get enough titanium without getting it from the USSR, and that they would have had to use a front company in any event as they had not publicly acknowledged the aircraft’s development.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#64

Post by mcpackieh »

ezzaf wrote: post #22

Perhaps a more accurate headline would have been this buried deeper in the article "The US worked through Third World countries and fake companies and finally was able to ship the ore to the US to build the SR-71." And to complete the loop, Russia is now importing sanctioned American microchips for its missiles via third parties. I wonder if the order form states they will be used in smart pizzas ovens.

> And to complete the loop, Russia is now importing sanctioned American microchips for its missiles via third parties.

I think they were doing exactly that back then too. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#65

Post by Gunnerhead »

epicureanideal wrote: post #30
varjag wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh absolutely. It's on my contingency TODO list.

There are a couple Georgian restaurants in the Bay Area, in Palo Alto and Los Altos.

I know I can easily Google this, but if anyone stumbles upon my comment and can recommend a delicious place serving it in NYC please let me know.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#66

Post by Gibbon1 »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #13

This is due a miscommunication. The SR-71 was originally developed for rapid pizza delivery(this was when companies took their pledge, “It’s hot or it’s free” seriously). It could deliver hot pizza to any point in the continental US rapidly allowing there to be full coverage with only a few actual pizza baking locations. Unfortunately, the Air Force saw the potential military implications and repurposed it.

They actually loaded the pizzas into the plane uncooked and relied on aerodynamic heating to cook it in flight.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#67

Post by mcpackieh »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #37
nimbius wrote: post #36

One has to wonder if or how this ever paid off. Once the sr71 showed up the USSR not only met the challenge with the Mig 25 foxbat a few years later, but outproduced the sr 71 to create strong coverage over most of Russia's airspace. Alone it couldn't catch the 71, but its r33 missiles and 600 kilowatt radar could If you owned a 71 it was probably a pretty bitter realization a plane less than half the price could sho…

Could a Foxbat shoot down an SR-71? The latter is like 0.6 Mach faster. The former was built out of steel, had an underpowered radar, couldn’t climb as high as a Blackbird and carried AA-6’s, which would have to lock and hit their target before the solid motors ran out [1]. To my knowledge the MiG-25’s claim to fame is shooting down an F-15 in the Gulf War. In any case, it’s clearly been worth it. The B-2, B-21 and R…

> Could a Foxbat shoot down an SR-71?

If it were in the right place at the right time (e.g. already in the air and in front of it so the SR71 comes to them..) Not impossible, but extremely circumstantial.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#68

Post by andsoitis »

anoy8888 wrote: post #59
nwallin wrote: post #42

Does any know any more details about this? It's a fun tidbit that gets a link/article on social media every few weeks, but it's never anything more than a tidbit. "The US needed titanium for the SR-71. The only supplier of titanium was the Soviet Union. So the US bought it from the Soviet Union through a shell corporation." But that's it. It's those 3 facts and only those three facts expressed in anywhere between one…

That is what China is doing to US now . Decades from now , Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable.

> Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable.

If they’re useless, how are they making chips and secret tech?

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#69

Post by sn41 »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #13

This is due a miscommunication. The SR-71 was originally developed for rapid pizza delivery(this was when companies took their pledge, “It’s hot or it’s free” seriously). It could deliver hot pizza to any point in the continental US rapidly allowing there to be full coverage with only a few actual pizza baking locations. Unfortunately, the Air Force saw the potential military implications and repurposed it.

Rumor has it that it could deliver hot pizza even to the USSR, which is probably why the Soviets donated titanium for the ovens.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#70

Post by auxym »

LispSporks22 wrote: post #46

Sounds like one of those oft repeated, memorable bullshit stories like the NASA space pen. Does the book site sources?

It's mentioned at least in Skunk Works, which is a first hand account from a Lockheed engineer that worked alongside Kelly Johnson during SR71 development.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/101438.Skunk_Works

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