Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels • Hacker News Board

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#151

Post by randomobserver » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 4:18 PM UTC

berntb wrote: post #106

ucee054 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

M&S hawks Israeli produce: http://www.boycott-israel.co.uk/business-links/133-marks-and... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marks_%26_Spencer#cite_note-53 Unfortunately I can't refer you to a comprehensive information source on companies supporting Israel, but you might find more information by googling for "jews for boycotting israeli goods" or "boycott divestment sanctions" I did find references to several other compan…

Sigh... I flagged the article. Please keep stories like this off HN, it is bad enough with the language wars people. (I follow the Middle East conflict a bit, because it is informative to compare my Swedish media with BBC/NY Times. News items such as Pallywood or torture between Palestinian groups are literally censored.) The basic reason I started to care a bit is because I find it depressing when people hate and de…

Based on your posts in this thread I'm really getting the feeling that you're an apologist for the human rights abuses Israel has perpetrated against their Arab citizens. Oh, maybe they aren't actually citizens because they aren't people.

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#152

Post by randomobserver » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 4:21 PM UTC

csomar wrote: post #36

I flagged this post. It's not a problem to discuss politics, but it should have a value. Do the HN community want to discuss the Palestinian-Israeli conflict? Fine, submit an article about that. But submitting such an article will only trigger a flame-war. The content of the article is of the kind that triggers 'oh, ass-hole Israeli', and 'oh, Palestinians uses this to kill innocents'. These are details. Not the actu…

Yes, let's just bury anything YOU disagree with. You're complaining about someone posting something and then say that they should post the very thing you accuse them of.

Do you think we should just ignore the human rights abuses that Israel is committing against the Arabs?

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#153

Post by randomobserver » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 4:24 PM UTC

davidkatz wrote: post #27

ComputerGuru wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because Israel limits the amount of power going into Gaza purposely. Not only are they refusing to provide them with power (they're obviously paying for it, not "taking" it from Israel), but they're also preventing them from generating their own electricity as well. Depending on where you are in Gaza, you have anywhere from four to eighteen hours of power a day under normal circumstances. When the tensions rise, you'…

Two questions: (1) Why do you think Israel should be obliged to supply electricity to a hostile territory, ruled by a government that explicitly states it's desire to destroy it [1], backed up with routine rocket fire into Israeli population centers? (2) How exactly is Israel preventing the generation of electricity in Gaza? [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas_Covenant EDIT: grammar correction

The Palestenians are people of the Israeli state. How can their own land and their own people be "hostile territory"?

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#154

Post by ucee054 » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 4:34 PM UTC

Untitled wrote: post #90

ucee054 wrote: post #62

This post is no less informative and no more political than, for example, this post on ACTA: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3620579 In my understanding it is in fact both acceptable under the guidelines and especially relevant to hackers and I will explain my reasoning on each point in order. The post is acceptable under the guidelines because it is factual reporting about Palestine and Israel, which is importan…

> I do not believe would normally get reported in the US media. Why? Because you believe in a conspiracy of US news companies? This is laughable. If you cannot read these stories then go to Huffington Post or similar circle jerk sites. THIS DOES NOT BELONG ON HN NEWS > I believe that the reason the facts about Palestine are suppressed is because of organized "Hasbara" (public relations) efforts by Israel's supporters…

> USS liberty was an accident that happened 40 years ago

The sale of the Phalcon radar to China is recent. The AIPAC espionage case is current http://original.antiwar.com/smith-grant/2009/09/01/steve-ros...

Why aren't these big news? Do you want more examples?

> But any case your tripe does not belong on Hacker News! Go back to reddit!

Your tripe belongs on http://masada2000.org/

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#155

Post by Untitled » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 4:57 PM UTC

ucee054 wrote: post #154

Untitled wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do not believe would normally get reported in the US media. Why? Because you believe in a conspiracy of US news companies? This is laughable. If you cannot read these stories then go to Huffington Post or similar circle jerk sites. THIS DOES NOT BELONG ON HN NEWS > I believe that the reason the facts about Palestine are suppressed is because of organized "Hasbara" (public relations) efforts by Israel's supporters…

> USS liberty was an accident that happened 40 years ago The sale of the Phalcon radar to China is recent. The AIPAC espionage case is current http://original.antiwar.com/smith-grant/2009/09/01/steve-ros... Why aren't these big news? Do you want more examples? > But any case your tripe does not belong on Hacker News! Go back to reddit! Your tripe belongs on http://masada2000.org/

> The sale of the Phalcon radar to China is recent.

You mentioned the USS Liberty and then I mentioned that it happened long ago. Then you mention something completely different and unrelated. Don’t change the topic and just answer me this:

1. Did the USS Liberty event happen more than 40 years ago?

2. Was it an accident?

> The sale of the Phalcon radar to China is recent.

Israel did not sell the Radar to China, you are lying to me.

Israel wanted to sell the systems to China and asked for permission from the USA. The USA denied it and they didn't sell it.

So what? The biggest trading partner of China is the USA. Do you see China as an enemy of the USA? Should the USA stop trading with China?

I would say that that is pretty nice from the sovereign state of Israel to ask for US permission first.

> Your tripe belongs on http://masada2000.org/

Again you accuse me of being either Jewish or a Jewish puppet. This is pathetic of you and I am quite sad of what has become of Hacker News.

I know it is quite fashionable for people with too much time on their hands to jump on some PC bandwagon such as Israel bashing. I just don’t think that you are ill informed, extremely naive and a hypocrite.

Hacker News was one of the last social sites where this tripe has been kept at bay. It is just sad that the likes of you will now also ruin HN.

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#156

Post by ucee054 » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 5:04 PM UTC

berntb wrote: post #150

ucee054 wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You insinuated that my discussion of Hasbara means that I am some kind of "disgusting" Nazi referencing "traditional anti semitic hate propaganda", when I was linking to the Israeli Citizens Information Council's own website. You may find it "depressing when people hate", well I find it depressing when people can't answer my points and so have to resort to declaring the subject to be off limits, then smearing me, and…

You have nothing to say about that the Arab countries destroy Palestinians' lives more than Israel ever did? Or my other points re double standards? >>You insinuated that my discussion of Hasbara means that I am some kind of "disgusting" Nazi referencing "traditional anti semitic hate propaganda", when I was linking to the Israeli Citizens Information Council's own website. You wrote that you thought the Jews control…

> You wrote that you thought the Jews controlled the information in the US media... That is less than one step from the Zion protocols, quoted in the Hamas charter etc.

This is not quite what I wrote, but whatever. Even if it were, it's not just the Okhrana, the Nazis and Hamas who say stuff like this either, it is also Zionist lobbyist Haim Saban (Link: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/05/10/100510fa_fact_...) The fact that he said the same thing doesn't make me a pro-Israel billionaire either, anymore than the Protocols make me the Tzarist secret police. The point is that you can dismiss something if it is untrue, not by calling names. You still owe me an apology.

> Even if the army follows the war laws. That is very different from targeting and glorifying murdering children, which I wrote about.

Israeli Tshirts depict pregnant Palestinians in sniper crosshairs, captioned "one shot two kills". Link: http://news.sky.com/home/world-news/article/15245946 That's two apologies you owe me.

> You have nothing to say about that the Arab countries destroy Palestinians' lives more than Israel ever did?

How? The Israeli ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians caused the refugee problem in the first place Israeli Link: http://zochrot.org/en

> Or my other points re double standards?

Again, see http://mondoweiss.net

But let's say you are right for the sake of argument that "Arab countries hurt Palestinians more than Israel ever did"

How is that justification for suppressing the factual reportage "Israeli authorities are threatening to demolish the installations in six of the 16 remote West Bank communities being illuminated by alternative energy, arguing the panels and turbines were installed without permits." ?

It is not. You are using untruths and smears to try to suppress the facts.

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#157

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 5:20 PM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #40

csomar wrote: post #36

I flagged this post. It's not a problem to discuss politics, but it should have a value. Do the HN community want to discuss the Palestinian-Israeli conflict? Fine, submit an article about that. But submitting such an article will only trigger a flame-war. The content of the article is of the kind that triggers 'oh, ass-hole Israeli', and 'oh, Palestinians uses this to kill innocents'. These are details. Not the actu…

Alright, let's do this thought experiment. Replace words like Israel and Palestine in the article with countries in Africa. Something like "Water pumps running off of solar power in Kenya, provided by a German start up are being removed by the local government". Would that be acceptable for HN? I am 80% confident, we wouldn't see all this discussion about how the story should have been flagged and or how it is totall…

[deleted]

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#158

Post by ucee054 » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 5:30 PM UTC

Untitled wrote: post #155

ucee054 wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> USS liberty was an accident that happened 40 years ago The sale of the Phalcon radar to China is recent. The AIPAC espionage case is current http://original.antiwar.com/smith-grant/2009/09/01/steve-ros... Why aren't these big news? Do you want more examples? > But any case your tripe does not belong on Hacker News! Go back to reddit! Your tripe belongs on http://masada2000.org/

> The sale of the Phalcon radar to China is recent. You mentioned the USS Liberty and then I mentioned that it happened long ago. Then you mention something completely different and unrelated. Don’t change the topic and just answer me this: 1. Did the USS Liberty event happen more than 40 years ago? 2. Was it an accident? > The sale of the Phalcon radar to China is recent. Israel did not sell the Radar to China, you…

>1. Did the USS Liberty event happen more than 40 years ago? >2. Was it an accident?

In the links in my original post 'Lt. Gen. Marshall Carter, the director of the NSA, told Congress that the attack "couldn't be anything else but deliberate."'

> Israel did not sell the Radar to China, you are lying to me.

You owe me a retraction. In the links in my original post "Cohen demanded Israel cancel the US $1-2 billion sale of 3-5 AWACS airborne radar aircraft to China." I never claimed the sale went through. It is pointless for me to cite the facts if you don't read the links.

More from the original links: " Former CIA Director James Woolsey testified Israel has covertly sold 'several billions' of dollars worth of top-secret US technology to Israel since 1983. The Inspector General of the US State Department found, in a 1992 report, a 'systematic and growing pattern' of Israel selling American military technology in direct violation of US law.

...

Pentagon sources charge Israel 'backdoored' US technology to China for the Patriot AA missile, other surface-to-air missiles; the PL-8 air-to-air missiles; C-802 anti-ship missiles; advanced composite tank armor and tank guns; aircraft avionics and ground radar systems; and the J-10 fighter, which is based on secret US technology used in Israel's cancelled 'Lavi' fighter. "

I believe a lot of hackers would think twice about supplying advanced technology to Israel if they knew the facts about Israelis trying to sell it to China (or in the old days Apartheid South Africa)

> Again you accuse me of being either Jewish or a Jewish puppet.

I accused you of supporting Israel. It is even more pointless for me to reply to you at all if you don't read what I write, just what you make up. In fact I think I'll stop replying to you henceforth.

> It is just sad that the likes of you will now also ruin HN.

Oh the Irony!

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#159

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 5:37 PM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #40

csomar wrote: post #36

I flagged this post. It's not a problem to discuss politics, but it should have a value. Do the HN community want to discuss the Palestinian-Israeli conflict? Fine, submit an article about that. But submitting such an article will only trigger a flame-war. The content of the article is of the kind that triggers 'oh, ass-hole Israeli', and 'oh, Palestinians uses this to kill innocents'. These are details. Not the actu…

Alright, let's do this thought experiment. Replace words like Israel and Palestine in the article with countries in Africa. Something like "Water pumps running off of solar power in Kenya, provided by a German start up are being removed by the local government". Would that be acceptable for HN? I am 80% confident, we wouldn't see all this discussion about how the story should have been flagged and or how it is totall…

[deleted]

Re: Israel to destroy Palestinians' solar panels

#160

Post by joeytm » Sun, Feb 26, 2012, 5:47 PM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #40

csomar wrote: post #36

I flagged this post. It's not a problem to discuss politics, but it should have a value. Do the HN community want to discuss the Palestinian-Israeli conflict? Fine, submit an article about that. But submitting such an article will only trigger a flame-war. The content of the article is of the kind that triggers 'oh, ass-hole Israeli', and 'oh, Palestinians uses this to kill innocents'. These are details. Not the actu…

Alright, let's do this thought experiment. Replace words like Israel and Palestine in the article with countries in Africa. Something like "Water pumps running off of solar power in Kenya, provided by a German start up are being removed by the local government". Would that be acceptable for HN? I am 80% confident, we wouldn't see all this discussion about how the story should have been flagged and or how it is totall…

I was banned for an critical comment on Apple. So I can tell you that their biases is not disguised anymore.

And now I have just been banned for this comment despite 4 upvotes...

And I can see that user "babbling" has been banned for this comment :

"Except that the Israeli Palestinian conflict is interesting to a lot of people and Hacker News tends to have more civilized discussions than some other places"

This doesn't feel right.