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North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

bbc.co.uk

31–40 of 100 posts

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#31
post #6

> Like most women in North Korea, she is the main earner in the family. The meagre wages men earn in their compulsory state jobs are all but worthless, forcing their wives to find creative ways to make a living. Really interesting! Economic policies have created a system where women earn much more than men on average. I think that's quite rare globally.

1. read the room; and 2. this is one of the most tone deaf comments I've ever read.

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would you have the world do? Tens of thousands of Americans died trying to prevent it in the Korean War. Even if North Korea didn't have nuclear capabilities, it's asking for Iraq 2.0 (dictatorship threatening others, populace under severe oppression)

If China decided they would no longer back North Korea, the regime could be replaced in hours. Most of the time, when toppling regimes, you have to be worried about someone even worse taking over. In this case, I don't see how it could get any worse.

Any worse? Pol Pot?

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#33
post #27
post #9

I think when looking back through history, the continued torture of the entire North Korean population is going to be one of the most tragic events of the 21st century. Despite the regime originating earlier, it feels to be most tragic now; long after any maligned geopolitical reason for the regime to exist has since disappeared. It’s something we don’t think about often currently, because it’s almost become a joke.…

> I think when looking back through history, the continued torture of the entire North Korean population is going to be one of the most tragic events of the 21st century. 1. Not the utterly pointless, banal conflicts started by lies and personal vendettas that have already killed hundreds of thousands and millions of people, spilled over into neighbouring (and not so neighbouring) countries, and destabilized entire p…

I’m not going to get into a conversation comparing tragedy to find the top 10. I said “one of” specifically for that reason. I don’t think deciding if there’s actually worse things going on actually adds anything here. (A thread specifically about North Korea)

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#34
post #29
post #9

I think when looking back through history, the continued torture of the entire North Korean population is going to be one of the most tragic events of the 21st century. Despite the regime originating earlier, it feels to be most tragic now; long after any maligned geopolitical reason for the regime to exist has since disappeared. It’s something we don’t think about often currently, because it’s almost become a joke.…

> I really feel like we’ll look back at how we ignored it for so long shamefully One of the big problems has long been that North-Korea has a large network of artillery within shelling distance of Seoul. Now they also have rockets and nukes and stuff, but even without those any serious threat to NK would come with devastating cost of civilian lives in South-Korea. See e.g. [1], which estimates that "the DPRK could ca…

That’s a good point, I was wrong to use “ignore”. It’s a lot more complicated.

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would have gave MacArthur whatever he needed to win.

What you are referring to is allowing MacArthur to have nuked China when they entered the Korean war, aka killing millions of civilians and leaving the eastern seaboard of China irradiated for generations. We should be glad he was kept on his leash.

> leaving the eastern seaboard of China irradiated for generations

It might depend on the particular warhead, but this was not the case for Hiroshima and Nagasaki...

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would have gave MacArthur whatever he needed to win.

What you are referring to is allowing MacArthur to have nuked China when they entered the Korean war, aka killing millions of civilians and leaving the eastern seaboard of China irradiated for generations. We should be glad he was kept on his leash.

MacArthur repeatedly rejected suggestions for such use of nuclear and chemical weapons, stating that he would only use them to prevent an ultimate fallback. It seems that others, such as Bradley, Ridgeway, Truman, and even Eisenhower were more in favor of escalation than MacArthur, who seems to have been made something of a scapegoat upon his dismissal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relief_of_Douglas_MacArthur#Nu...

Sidenote: I am not a MacArthur 'fan', but he was a very complex character

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#37
I just can't understand what motivates so much violence towards a whole population. This is a mystery to me.

Even if it's greed or something, how are you happy with yourself and sleep well when you are causing so much harm? I usually try hard to understand fellow human beings but I'm badly failing here.

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#38

North Korea runs contrary to my intuition about dictators. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big supporter of regicide, but most dictatorships, even among the most horrific, represent some sort of misguided attempt at benevolance. Killing dissidents? Sure, they're getting in the way of your utopian plan. Failed economic plans that lead to famine? Well, the idea had some justification, better pivot to avoid further harm. Hell…

In Kim Il-Sung's (the first of the Kims) time there was some sort of attempt at improving the lines of the North Koreans (as ineffectual as it was), but certainly in the reigns of his son Kim Jong-Il and his grandson Kim Jong-Un, it does look like power for the sake of power. I suspect at this point there is a fear (not just from Kim Jong-Un but also the higher ranks of the military and administration) that any sort of reform will lead to them not only losing power but also their lives.

Re: North Koreans speak secretly to BBC from inside closed country

#39
post #37

I just can't understand what motivates so much violence towards a whole population. This is a mystery to me. Even if it's greed or something, how are you happy with yourself and sleep well when you are causing so much harm? I usually try hard to understand fellow human beings but I'm badly failing here.

It's not any different from capitalists having terrible working conditions in their factories. Humans have an enormous capacity to ignore others' suffering as long as they have a good life themselves. And somehow they always find a way to rationalize this.
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