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First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

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Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#191

Post by gojomo »

throwaway5752 wrote: post #137
muglug wrote: post #77

[flagged]

Michael Shellenberger has done the same - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Shellenberger has details, and see criticism of the Breakthrough Institute. Alex Gutentag seems to be a contributing editor to Compact, writing things like https://compactmag.com/article/how-mask-mandates-defaced-us . A brief review of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_(American_magazine) shows a lot of familiar names of people that p…

All you need for a market cluster is one infected person to visit once, & pass the infection along to one or more people who then also spend time there and pass it on. There's no challenging "why" needed.

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#192

Post by cmpb »

Obviously, we should try to figure it out and learn from our mistakes, increase security, etc., but what accountability can we really expect from knowing that the pandemic started due to a lab leak? Accountability is almost meaningless compared to the scale of the total global loss.

I'm reminded of a line from an episode of Star Trek TNG where a very powerful alien destroys an entire race by thinking them out of existence in a momentary lapse of judgement, and Picard simply says "We're not qualified to be your judges -- we have no law to fit your crime."

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#194

Post by baja_blast »

jb12 wrote: post #30

> "If you knew that this was likely a lab-enhanced pathogen, there are so many things you could have done differently" I'm curious - if we knew in March 2020 that covid came from a lab, what _would_ we have done differently?

If we knew it was from a lab much of the confusion over H2H transmission, Airborne transmission, asymptomatic infections would have been known much earlier. We would have take the correct measure earlier and saved lives.

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#195

Post by hwillis »

Vrondi wrote: post #175
onethought wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which still doesn’t really draw the line of how an outbreak occurred at the wet market. Also common seasonal illness isn’t exactly a smoking gun

If a single staff person caught a virus, then anyone they interacted with and gave it to went to the market, then that's all it would take.

Incredibly unlikely. There are thousands of locations that are far more trafficked than the wet market: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9348750/figure/...

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#196

Post by hcurtiss »

throwaway5752 wrote: post #137
muglug wrote: post #77

[flagged]

Michael Shellenberger has done the same - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Shellenberger has details, and see criticism of the Breakthrough Institute. Alex Gutentag seems to be a contributing editor to Compact, writing things like https://compactmag.com/article/how-mask-mandates-defaced-us . A brief review of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_(American_magazine) shows a lot of familiar names of people that p…

>All signs point to misinformation.

What does that even mean? That you don't trust these people? Isn't that, definitionally, ad hominem?

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#197

Post by toomim »

squalo wrote: post #108
sixQuarks wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you say that? What evidence do you have that his reporting is suspect?

I take it you haven't been keeping up with the twitter files controversy?

You throw out an accusation without evidence.

Then someone asks you for evidence, and you throw out an accusation at that person instead of giving any evidence.

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#198

Post by hwillis »

nomel wrote: post #111
onethought wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which still doesn’t really draw the line of how an outbreak occurred at the wet market. Also common seasonal illness isn’t exactly a smoking gun

Outbreaks can only happen in places of high density/congregation, by the nature of the required proximity. It could have been dancing around the perimeter for some time. Maybe my perspective is incorrect, but this seems trivially possible to me. This problem with proximity is why kids didn't go to school.

The wet market was one of the less densely trafficked areas of the city: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9348750/figure/...

Check out the other figures in that paper. The epicenter was the wet market itself.

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#199

Post by autokad »

hwillis wrote: post #16

Note that this is NOT the Wuhan CDC, which is the building across the river from the wet market. They did not do any research there. This building is ~10 miles south, well outside the main city. https://geohack.toolforge.org/geohack.php?pagename=Wuhan_Ins... The fact that researchers were sick with flu-like symptoms has been openly stated by the US for a long time. This was put out in the state department Jan 2021, 2…

just a guess, but mid august was the first outbreak and September 21st was when they realized it was out of control.

Re: First people sickened by Covid-19 were scientists at WIV: US government sources

#200

Post by [deleted] »

Imnimo wrote: post #89

It is hard to tell from the writing - are the sources claiming that they know the researchers were sick with Covid-19 specifically, or are they saying they know the researchers with sick with something, and that they had symptoms consistent with covid-19? We go from: >Sources within the US government say that three of the earliest people to become infected with SARS-CoV-2 were Ben Hu, Yu Ping, and Yan Zhu. To: >not o…

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