Live data from Hacker News

Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

openculture.com

41–50 of 123 posts

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#41
post #25

Crowley, and his forebear Eliphas Levi, are responsible for the stupid air of sulphur which hangs around a lot of modern esoterica. AC has his apologists, and he was obviously clever, but he was unquestionably a complete turd, and created a religious system which was fundamentally Satanic, wrapped in enough layers of obfuscation that it can fascinate intelligent people, especially those who have received a substandar…

> There are better ways of squaring the circle, but they're less sexy. Don't tell me: You learned of these ways from the one True Scotsman.

Doubtful. Sean Connery has been dead for several years now.

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#42
post #3

I dunno man. They both seem kinda intellectually obsessive. All that writing.

I kind of get it. Make the words count, don't count the words.

Or as it was put in Buddhism, a thousand words are pointless compared to a single word that brings peace.

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#44
post #25

Crowley, and his forebear Eliphas Levi, are responsible for the stupid air of sulphur which hangs around a lot of modern esoterica. AC has his apologists, and he was obviously clever, but he was unquestionably a complete turd, and created a religious system which was fundamentally Satanic, wrapped in enough layers of obfuscation that it can fascinate intelligent people, especially those who have received a substandar…

So you say he fooled all the people with magic, and he waited on Satan's call?

> Someone asked why Crowley is perennially popular on HN.

Because people are waiting for a Marvel to take them to space.

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#45

Highly recommend W. Sommerset Maughm's "The Magician" for a treatment of Crowley's personality and influence. The occult is full of tedious charlatans, and yet they reappear in history in influential forms like Machiavelli, Rasputin, Crowley, Mesmer, Bernays, Marcuse, and other literal mesmerists, with lesser lights as 20th century cult leaders, and I think Klaus Schwab and his transhumanist hokum is the current equi…

Marxism is materialist, how is it predicated on occult or gnostic premises?

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#46
Many people have had experiences that fall into categories that make them difficult to speak about. Because they may not be universally shared experiences, there's not much of a common vocabulary that feels adequate.

To me, a large part religion seems to be to provide such a vocabulary, and therefore, purposefully or not, monopolize the description of such experiences. By doing so, they inevitably funnel the rationalization of these experiences into certain paths.

The reductive alternatives offered by skeptics are not usually a satisfying substitute, since they are usually not talking about the same thing. Skeptics like to shift the conversation to what they consider the objective which, while not necessarily wrong, is a different conversation, and beside the point. To make an inadequate comparison: it's like discussing the objective nature and accuracy of poetry rather than the experience of it, and the impact on the reader.

There are many other ways to look at the development of western occultism, but from the perspective of language, it seems to me that it had a lot to do with establishing a framework that tries to side-step the effective monopoly of religious conversation, as well as the only alternative offered: plain denial of the experience.

You could, of course, lump the history of occultism in with religion and say "it's not significantly different"/"it's a mish-mash of borrowed ideas from traditional religion"/etc., if painting with broad brushstrokes, but I think it was a conscious effort to break out of the frameworks set by convention and religion.

It's an attempt to take command of the internal and external conversation regarding something deeply personal.

I believe this is important, because putting language to something (whether it's words or symbols) is a hugely important way to internalize, process, and develop the results of an experience, whatever it is.

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#47
post #9

For anyone insterested in reading Crowley, I was told Liber four is the most straightforward writing of his. His collection of poems "White Stains" is just amazing as well - mostly speaking about human secretions of all kinds and ingesting them. Edit:"White Stains, a collection of Crowley's poetry praised by W.B. Yeats, published in paperback for the first time, has been called 'the filthiest book of verse ever writt…

Your description makes me think it's a little gross. Is there something I'm missing as to why such poetry is worth reading?

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#48
post #20

There seems to be interest on HN when it comes to articles about Crowley and similar figures. Can some one help me understand why it's popular with this audience?

I don’t reckon HN is a coherent whole that can be this audienced .

You're correct, but there are enough in this audience that upvote and share this stuff to get me wondering why.

I'm not making a judgement on the topic, but it seems to me to be a little different to most everything else on here.

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#49
post #20

There seems to be interest on HN when it comes to articles about Crowley and similar figures. Can some one help me understand why it's popular with this audience?

I’ve wondered the same thing too. I don’t really keep up to date on political stuff, but I get the feeling that there is a history that links libertarianism, the tech sector, transhumanism, and occultism. I had seen stuff about how Peter Thiel has funded a bunch of art-related events that may sometimes utilize this esoteric aesthetic.

Crowley inspired Jack Parsons who helped found the Jet Propulsion Lab. He’s the forerunner of the 60s free-love & drugs movement, which informs Steven Brand’s Whole Earth Catalog and Don Buchla.

Crowley’s also the easiest mystic to find in the English speaking world, and maybe “the west”. He cultivated infamy, leaving traces of himself all over the media through the early 20th century.

I think he’s the first “influencer”, the first to take power-for-power’s sake out of church and national leadership and to use it to influence the public at large. And he also pretends to teach others how to do that too, through his writings. He’s the model for all TV evangelists. (Actually, he was rubbish at bringing in money so he’s the model of what not to do if you want to be a TV evangelist)

He’s also a case study in the moral decay of power. Born rich; squandered it all; cares about no-one whilst professing a system of universal love; retired to relative obscurity, heroin addiction, and obsession with prostitutes.

The tarot deck he made with Lady Frida Harris is incredible.

Re: Aleister Crowley and William Butler Yeats get into an occult battle (2016)

#50
post #25

Crowley, and his forebear Eliphas Levi, are responsible for the stupid air of sulphur which hangs around a lot of modern esoterica. AC has his apologists, and he was obviously clever, but he was unquestionably a complete turd, and created a religious system which was fundamentally Satanic, wrapped in enough layers of obfuscation that it can fascinate intelligent people, especially those who have received a substandar…

> ...substandard education in theology. Isn't most of theology just folks getting red faced arguing over things which are ultimately just made up, and are unknowable anyway in the first place? It's only a step away from a couple of guys shouting at each other about how the warp nacelles work in Star Trek.

There's a substantive difference between a religious argument on Twitter and proper theological argument which leans into philosophy. The problem is that people aren't typically exposed to the good stuff because teachers and the media don't know it either. Sadly even local religious leaders; that's a serious issue.
Post reply on HN