> Proposals range from charging vehicles $9 to $23 during peak hours, and it’s set to go into effect next spring.
Sounds like a giveaway of use of public streets to the wealthy.
New York City will charge drivers going downtown
461–470 of 700 posts
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#462NYC is overrated... The good people left decades ago. If you are one of the unfortunate ones who has to actually take the train every day downtown, I can't tell you how many times I've been in fist fights in the train simply because I was wearing a suit on the wall street train, or the christopher street PATH train. People spit on you, they want to fight because you represent corporate america. The trains are BS. Better learn jiu jitsu before getting on one. lol.
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#463Wow. So much negativity. As far as I’m concerned, even if the city burns every dollar it collects, if this gets some cars off the island, it’s a win. It’s time to stop tolerating personal vehicles in our most dense urban centers.
It’s never that simple. There are loads of people for which a personal or work vehicle is a necessity. Public transport cannot, and is never designed to catch every edge case.
I’m all for better public transportation but strong statements and mishandled public funds just sways the support of the average joe.
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#464Earlier quoted context omitted.
Motorcycles should be charged according to the decibel volume of their engine.
I’m extraordinarily noise sensitive and I find this appealing for emotional reasons. But I don’t think it’s good policy nonetheless. IME motorcycle drivers are generally among the most respectful about the noise they make, relative to all drivers of all vehicle types. They scoot through and move on. I’d definitely like to charge drivers for their relative noise impact, but I’d start with the recreational sports car d…
In NYC specifically, by far the loudest vehicles are dirt bikes — people ride them through streets with absolutely no regard for safety or pedestrians, running reds and honking and revving their engines. I think what you have said is generally true in other US cities I’ve been to though.
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#465Earlier quoted context omitted.
Quite a few of our transit problems today are actually because of the choices Robert Moses made. However, he certainly is responsible for the rapid growth of the transit system and did a great job consolidating power and getting stuff done. * He had the chance to buy the land and put transit along many highways in queens and Long Island but said that people would prefer to drive so he passed on the opportunity. Acqui…
I'm well aware of his history, and it's always interesting to me how few bad things people can point to that he actually did.. when weighed against all the transit/bridges/tunnels/highways build under his watch. I mean the first thing is a crime of omission, made in basically every other city of the country - where have we seen land be purchased along highways to build transit done anywhere in this country? Even new…
> The second one is obviously morally wrong, though even that is in dispute
I don't really think this one is in dispute honestly:
Now he began taking measures to limit use of his parks. He had restricted the
use of state parks by poor and lower-middle-class families in the first place,
by limiting access to the parks by rapid transit he had vetoed the Long Island
Rail Road's proposed construction of a branch spur to Jones Beach for this
reason. Now he began to limit access by busses; he instructed Shapiro to build
the bridges across his new parkways low - too low for buses to pass. Bus trips
therefore had to be made on local roads, making the trips discouraging long and
arduous.
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#466My main concern as NYer is the governments inability to build transit, and not for lack of money. NY will find it relatively easy to institute a new tax on drivers, but will the billions collected actually make transit better in any tangible way? NYC is also hamstrung by having its streets controlled locally by our DOT, but our transit & bridges controlled by a state agency. We just caved (again) entirely to the tran…
Congestion pricing is good insofar as it deters driving. We do need to get our heads out of our asses with respect to the logistics of converting dollars to transit infrastructure, but that's basically independent. Congestion pricing revenue could be given to your favorite charity, redistributed as a citizen's dividend, or lit on fire. The important thing is that as the marginal driver the amount you have to part with is painful enough to you to change your behavior.
In any other US metro area, there is perhaps a realist argument that roads work fine for 98% of trips and trains are too much of a boondoggle for their marginal contribution to capacity. But this is Manhattan. Forget for a moment about urbanism, environmentalism, etc. If the MTA melted down tomorrow, no appreciable portion of its riders could fall back on driving, as a matter of geometry.
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#467My main concern as NYer is the governments inability to build transit, and not for lack of money. NY will find it relatively easy to institute a new tax on drivers, but will the billions collected actually make transit better in any tangible way? NYC is also hamstrung by having its streets controlled locally by our DOT, but our transit & bridges controlled by a state agency. We just caved (again) entirely to the tran…
Please, let's not have another Robert Moses. Dude was power hungry scumbag
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#468Earlier quoted context omitted.
> regressive tax I don't think that word means what you think it means.
It does, but if you'll elaborate on your incorrect understanding I'd be happy to educate you: https://ops.fhwa.dot.gov/publications/fhwahop08040/cp_prim5_... > most forms of transportation finance—fuel taxes, sales taxes, and tolls—are regressive forms of taxation in that they burden the poor more than they do the rich.
I agree with you, and the source, that most transportation taxes are regressive. Where you lose me is that THIS one is. Driving into Manhattan isn't something the vast majority of poorer commuters are doing.
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#469I assumed "downtown" means below 14th st or something like that - an unusual area to focus congestion charges on.
They are actually talking about all of downtown and midtown - south of 60th street - which is yea the busier part of the city, just not what an actual NYer refer to as "downtown"
Re: New York City will charge drivers going downtown
#470Earlier quoted context omitted.
>NYC, and Manhattan specifically, is one of the rare places in the country where having a car is almost virtually unnecessary. As long as you are okay with spending all your time in the city. The medium to long distance public transport for going out of the city is horrible.
Compared to the rest of the world maybe, compared to the rest of the US, I struggle to think of anywhere better.
The point is you still need a car, and approximately half the people (instead of 60-75% like in other cities) own cars in New York.