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Ted Kaczynski has died

nytimes.com

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Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#331

Post by numpad0 »

arp242 wrote: post #164
znpy wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

one of the funniest things for me is the fact that many left-wing people add Kaczynski quotes without realizing that left-wing people are basically the first people to be criticized and almost mocked in Ted's main piece, "Industrial society and its future"

I would describe myself as left-wing, and I agree with some (not all) of his criticisms of "the left" in general. Turns out that left-wing people can have disagreements. Furthermore, I can reject argument X while simultaneously also accepting argument Y from the same person or book.

Turns out leftists love self criticism for self improvements. That’s inherently bad, right?

(set aside that it often builds up to violent inner conflicts)

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#332

Post by boppo1 »

local_crmdgeon wrote: post #47
bheadmaster wrote: post #35

Ted Kaczynski was a genius, a mathematical child prodigy, became a professor at Berkeley at 25 and had a bright future. I completely blame CIA experiments for his downfall into radicalism and extremism. His ideas were very valid, but his mind was too tortured to deal with them in a healthy manner. Rest in peace.

The media will report on this as the death of a terrorist. None of the real terrorists will be brought to justice - the CIA has done so many abhorrent things here and abroad. We act like the KGB/FSB is this unfathomable, foreign evil. We have the bigger, scarier thing that killed it in our backyard.

The CIA has done some bad shit, even to their own citizens, but are they really on the level of the KGB? Seems like the KGB was a more overt daily-life terror, whereas the CIA has a more 'occasional' history of atrocities.

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#333

Post by jmull »

2-718-281-828 wrote: post #248

he moved into a shack in the mountains searching for tranquility and silence. just to get tormented there by noise from local wood industry and dogs. So, he kills the dogs and then sabotages machinery. for me - he's an unsung hero. may he finally rest in peace now.

He’s a hero for killing dogs because they annoyed him?

I think that’s sick, not heroic.

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#334

Post by FpUser »

ripourhero wrote: post #107
sebmellen wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a person who exhibited such deranged behavior, his writing and arguments are remarkably clear and cool-headed.

Out of curiosity, have you ever heard of operation condor? project mkultra? As far as I know from studying history, it's impossible to win (= survive as a culture against encroachment from different cultures) without violence. Today's mantra of pacifism and non-violence is just propaganda from current governments (all of which were originally installed through bloodshed, and kept in power through never-ending bloodsh…

>"and avoid being toppled like their predecessors"

Ok. You topple one. If you do not create a replacement government you will have people preyed upon by violent gangs when eventually one become powerful enough to form new government. And if you do you are back to square one. So maybe it is better to try to fix what you have while trying to avoid violence. I am not telling it is always possible but at least it can be a goal.

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#335

Post by gonehome »

MollyRealized wrote: post #262
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

unless you can show with substantive research that there are some ideas that cannot be held by violent terrorists I don't see why that would color these particular ideas.

I'd argue that these ideas cannot be held by violent terrorists: * Commitment to avoid causing physical or emotional harm to others. * Absolute respect and preservation of all human lives, without exceptions. * Unconditional rejection of violence under any circumstances. * Belief that every human has the right to live, and recognition of the dignity, worth, and autonomy of every individual. * Full acceptance of diffe…

Most people hold wildly inconsistent views in their head all the time, despite obvious contradictions - it’s the default human behavior.

https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/CqyJzDZWvGhhFJ7dY/belief-in-...

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#336

Post by krapp »

vlovich123 wrote: post #145
jscipione wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brittney Spears comes to mind, she is still under a conservatorship after her mk-ultra caused mental break.

MK ULTRA stopped in 1973 as far as I know. Claiming that Britney Spears’ mental issues are caused by this seems novel and I’ve never heard of this before. Do you have a news letter I can subscribe to to hear more of your insights?

The modern conspiracy theory version of MKUltra is known as "Project Monarch"[0,1]. Basically that various celebrities are being conditioned by "trauma based mind control programming" to engage in satantic ritual sex slavery for "the elites."

[0]https://www.vice.com/en/article/9bne7e/the-monarch-mind-cont...

[1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathy_O%27Brien_(conspiracy_th...

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#337

Post by watwut »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #84
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

unless you can show with substantive research that there are some ideas that cannot be held by violent terrorists I don't see why that would color these particular ideas.

That still does not imply we should listen to people like Kaczynsky or take his ideas seriously. He sux and should not matter. If someone else with better decisions making recond expresses same ideas in another context, we can listen to him.

The only thing that distinguishes Kaczynsky from, well, any random dude, are the bombs. Otherwise he is a no one. And random dude that did not send bombs makes more sense to listen to.

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#338

Post by Tao3300 »

next_xibalba wrote: post #63
local_crmdgeon wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The media will report on this as the death of a terrorist. None of the real terrorists will be brought to justice - the CIA has done so many abhorrent things here and abroad. We act like the KGB/FSB is this unfathomable, foreign evil. We have the bigger, scarier thing that killed it in our backyard.

> real terrorists Did the CIA fabricate and mail the bombs?

Whether or not the CIA was behind the psychological abuse he was subjected to, that it was made the bombmaker.

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#339

Post by watwut »

siftrics wrote: post #290
jstarfish wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was only one live bomb found and he did intend to use it. > Kaczynski replied Penthouse was less "respectable" than The New York Times and The Washington Post, and said that, "to increase our chances of getting our stuff published in some 'respectable' periodical", he would "reserve the right to plant one (and only one) bomb intended to kill, after our manuscript has been published" if Penthouse published the d…

Just because he bombed people previously doesn't mean he intended to do it again. You have to have stronger evidence, like writings or postage stamps, to prove beyond reasonable doubt that these two bombs were going to be planted. (I'm not arguing this evidence doesn't exist.) I don't get what the big deal is. We already have more than enough evidence from his previous plantings to convict him as a bomb planter and p…

He does not need any of that. He is not about to put Kaczynsky to jail. He is doing moral judgement and that one requires only reasonable probability.

> Is it just that you can't compartmentalize and separate the two things in your mind?

They are not separate. Past behavior predicts future one. And ignoring probabilities is just demanding that people act as if they were stupid.

Re: Ted Kaczynski has died

#340

Post by boppo1 »

arp242 wrote: post #254
tyingq wrote: post #186

I'm very surprised he didn't die earlier. Take his mental state at sentencing, then consider he was in ADX Florence Supermax from 1998 to December of 2021...23 years. The regimen there is 23 hours a day by yourself in your cell. There's one hour a day outside in a sunken concrete area, each prisoner is placed in an individual 12x18 foot wire-mesh cage, and can speak to other nearby caged prisoners under the watch of…

His cell was apparently 12×7-foot, or 3.6×2.1 metres (I was curious). Seems awfully tiny, and personally I consider it inhumane no matter what he has done, but apparently he wasn't too unhappy with it: "I consider myself to be in a (relatively) fortunate situation here. As correctional institutions go, this place is well-administered. It’s clean, the food is good, and it’s quiet, so that I can sleep, think and write…

did they allow much of his writing out of the prison? Who holds the rights to something written in prison in the US?
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