Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset • Hacker News Board

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#421

Post by m_mueller » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:35 AM UTC

I think it's still a couple of years out, but what about a little thought experiment: Let's say you had a pair of normal looking glasses that do everything that Vision Pro is doing now [1] and cost, say, 1500 USD. This would IMO be a no-brainer, as you can then augment any space and activity you want with having views into the digital world - for work, for hobbies, you name it. That would IMO be a mass market device on the level of today's smartphones.

Now, the question is, how much worse can it be and still sell well? How good is good enough? How soon will we see the plastic iPhone 3G equivalent at half the price, 70% the weight and 150% the battery life? After listening to the first hand experiences I do think Apple is onto something here, and this could be the beginning of the next step, finally going beyond what Douglas Engelbart has already envisioned in terms of digital augmentation of our lifes (on which we're IMO only now getting to a full realisation, almost 60 years later).

[1] listen to yesterday's Cortex podcast, they go over all the details after first hand experience, and it's quite interesting to say the least.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#422

Post by jen729w » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:36 AM UTC

This feels like a technology that will be ‘ready’ in ten (twenty?) years, but to dismiss it now a) feels unimaginative and b) precludes that from ever happening.

Do I want to wear big goggles? No. Do I, one day, want a device that can magically project anything I want on to my field of vision, and for it to be as realistic as my actual vision?

Hell yeah I do! And we can’t get there unless we go through the ski goggles phase. So, here we are.

I feel the same way about people complaining that the headphone jack was removed. ‘The phone is thin enough!’, they say. No it isn’t! My god where’s your imagination. The phone is good enough when it’s wafer thin and I can have it protein-printed on my arm or whatever.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#423

Post by liendolucas » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:37 AM UTC

I share similar thoughts.

If we go back in time to the mobile phone era, just before the iphone was released, the mobile market was actually flourishing and very solid: companies like nokia, motorola and blackberry managed to make mobile phones something as common as a TV, almost everyone had one.

At the time Apple introduced the iphone with its touchscreen and virtual keyboard, forever game changers to the whole mobile industry. The rest is history.

VR has been in the market for some time now and despite the fact that competitors haven't reached the level of technology that Apple has unveiled, those cheaper alternatives are by no means something that are either underdeveloped or half-way unusable products. I've tried a pair of Occulus few years ago and found them pretty impressive (putting aside all their flaws).

I must assume that since then these got better and prices actually dropped a bit, and if they haven't they are still way way cheaper than what Apple will be selling next year and I'm sure you can have a ton of fun with budget ones as well.

But yet... Why VR goggles can't be found in homes the same way that TVs, mobile phones and other popular electronic products despite that they are already affordable? Why hasn't this technology became mainstream? Is it maybe due to the fact that the VR experience can't be shared the same way that when we turn on a TV, play with friends with a gaming console on the couch or sit down on a desk with a PC and we share its use? Is it because it lacks that mythical killer VR app that could be a gamer changer? Is it because the industry hasn't released as much software for VR as for other more common devices like consoles, PCs, mobile phones?

It feels as if there's still something inherently missing in VR that won't make you go and buy a pair of goggles no matter how technologically advanced they become. And people spend a lot of money on expensive phones, gadgets and the alike...

Maybe I'm wrong and shortsighted and the answer is actually trivial.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#424

Post by askafriend » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:41 AM UTC

Why can't more immersive entertainment be an exciting goal and vision? That alone is amazing. To have an entire movie theater in any room in your house or in an airplane.

Or gaming.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#425

Post by Juliate » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:41 AM UTC

I see it more like the Vision Pro is the bulky Apple II equivalent (in a very positive, optimistic way) of what spatial computing is going to be - and perhaps Dynamicland was another take at the same « target ».

It’s bulky because/in the sense, how much top technology and work has been designed into it to validate and refine even further the vision with more users and developers.

It’s also bulky in an other sense, because how massive it is to wear still; and how social etiquette around it barely exist (but is also taken into account/proposed/embedded in this first public iteration).

It definitely make sense because it opens a really opiniated conceptual door to a different way of interacting with computers.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#426

Post by nologic01 » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:41 AM UTC

The headphone analogy is a good one and maybe sheds some light on the different nature of these "visual" headphones.

Headphones are in a sense "additive": they take a channel (auditory) that for a prolonged period of time might be underused while we go on about our lives and utilize it in an unobtrusive way. You can listen to podcasts while doing other stuff. We can optionally upgrade the experience: If you want, you can close your eyes and lose yourself in music.

Goggles are necessarily subtractive. Whatever you do while immersed must justify the fact that you are obstructing your primary contact with the world. It may well be that there are worthwhile pursuits but its a bit odd that they don't advertise themselves.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#427

Post by jjcon » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:42 AM UTC

Apple specifically has said they will not have controllers so yeah… that’s already how it has played out

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#428

Post by darawk » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:44 AM UTC

> So far at least, this is a tech that is being pushed onto people rather than being pulled.

I think it's very hard to tell the difference between these things ex ante. Everything that succeeds looks like it was pulled. But many things were pushed before they were pulled. Buying things on the internet, for instance. This was laughed at for quite a while, while a few people and companies were committed to the idea that it was the future. They were right of course, so right that it feels like it was effortless and demanded by the public, but it wasn't. Not at first.

That isn't to say that that will happen with VR either. Just to say that there is a long history of things being pushed hard and finally breaking through and becoming a near universal norm, and there is a long history of things being pushed hard and dying and being completely forgotten.

The promise of VR is to unlock a world free of the constraints of physics. Where physical distance prevents certain styles of communication and interaction - where physical real estate is finite and therefore rivalrous, etc. There are many things that VR, in principle, could solve. Whether or not the tech can deliver those things in a way that partially (or totally?) replaces actual physical reality remains to be seen. It is clear though that if you want to weave tech into the fabric of people's lives in the deepest possible way, something like VR is probably your best bet.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#429

Post by labrador » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:44 AM UTC

Maybe you haven't experienced the feeling of embodiment that Zuckerberg likes to go on about. You feel like your "in" the world with others, not in the solitary room of your physical world with your eyes staring at screens. I've felt embodied, but the resolution and processor speed with current tech keeps glitching me out of it. Reality doesn't have lags and glitches, so if you have them, it doesn't feel real.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg on Apple’s Vision Pro headset

#430

Post by 5350-uiop-1130 » Fri, Jun 09, 2023, 6:45 AM UTC

zuckerborg is a dork. there is something relatable to his awkwardness. at least for me.

apple is presenting a holier than thou image. we are giving you permission to pay us $3500 for ability to send blue coloured bubble messages to your iFace from our heavenly walled garden.