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SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

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Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#251

Post by j0hnyl »

bostonsre wrote: post #185
j0hnyl wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imo, it's the opposite. I just think HN's anti-crypto sentiment just hows how "normie" this community is.

Why do you think that the people that understand the technology generally have a negative view about it? Are "normies" just dense? Or do you think everything is based on jealousy? What community that wouldn't have confirmation bias would understand crypto currency better? And what are their thoughts on it?

The folks that I'm referring to as normies in this case, even though they might be technically literate, suffer from a lack of creativity. That's what makes them normies.

Personally, I'm fully against promoting crypto as an end all be all solution to economic problems the way that many scammers do. I'm even against trying to onboard the masses.

However, I see in crypto and smart contracts a green field of opportunity to experiment with unique forms and formats of human interaction using the medium of programmable money.

For example, I like how NFTs (despite many shortcomings) play with the concept of digital ownership. I also like how defi brings us unique financial instruments like flash loans, etc.

I think draconian regulation in this space will effectively squeeze a lot of these experiments out from under legitimate actors. It's a technology that is worth playing with. I think it's better to punish bad actors rather than raise the barrier to entry for the tech.

Of course you are right that enthusiasts of the technology would have a confirmation bias, but the opposite is also true. The confirmation bias here is that this is de facto bad.

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#252

Post by j0hnyl »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #195
j0hnyl wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

crypto makes things much easier to track

Not all crypto is created equal. Monero is pretty much the state of the art for private electronic money.

I've heard folks that work at Chainalysis claim that they can track monero better than zcash.

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#253

Post by bostonsre »

GoblinSlayer wrote: post #235
TeMPOraL wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the contrary. "Normies" were very positive about crypto, mostly because they were used by the crypto people from the early days, as fodder for their various get-rich-quick scams. The "anti-crypto sentiment" that was the unwavering average sentiment on HN is, to me, a point of pride, and I'm thankful for it, because it inoculated me when I was most vulnerable - early on, where it wasn't obvious yet what type of peo…

Anticrypto arguments like "it can be used for crime", "you have nothing to hide", "it's easier to give my credit card to the merchant" are obviously aligned with normie mentality.

Ignoring the fact that there is massive amounts of fraud and room for crime in the crypto currency space by denigrating the opposing viewpoint doesn't progress the conversation and just keeps the tribalism and fighting at the same levels. If you truly believe in crypto currency, why not try to address the concerns and push crypto currency in a direction that would ensure wider adoption?

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#254

Post by bostonsre »

GoblinSlayer wrote: post #243
bostonsre wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, I'm not sure what proportion of the negative camp is negative because of issues in early iterations like power consumption used by bitcoin which is solved with newer tech and what proportion is negative due to the use cases themselves. I do think that a lot of the tech itself is pretty elegant but I'm less certain on whether it's the right solution. I also think the fact that many in the pro camp have investment…

You hope for regulation, but so far regulation protected the capital from responsibility.

Regulation would be the least bad approach I think. The current crypto currency direction is untenable currently with the massive amounts of fraud present.

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#255

Post by tialaramex »

latchkey wrote: post #244
raincom wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$35k cash makes the dealership to file a currency transaction report with FinCen. For that matter, any entry/exit of untraceable monetary instruments(cash, money orders) > $10k is filed as a CTR. This is not a big issue; people get panicked, then structure their transactions(multiple cash transactions each $10k in total over time), thereby leading to a SAR(suspicious activity report). Mandatory reporters(banks, deale…

I have some inheritance cash that I received when my grandma died. Right now, it is soaking up some nice 4.9% apy, but eventually I'd like to buy a car (waiting for the prices to crash a bit more). It is what she would have wanted (she bought me my first car). I can't wait to walk into a dealership, with cash, and find out what sort of criminal I am.

There's no reason you would be a criminal, if they're comfortable taking so much cash (you didn't specify how much, dealers may vary in how willing they are to accept very large cash purchases) they will doubtless be comfortable filling out the mandatory reporting.

The investigators are looking for patterns, and latchkey having one dead grandma and buying one car isn't a pattern. They can't see patterns if the data which would make up the pattern isn't recorded, so that why the data is collected.

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#256

Post by redsky880 »

bostonsre wrote: post #253
GoblinSlayer wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anticrypto arguments like "it can be used for crime", "you have nothing to hide", "it's easier to give my credit card to the merchant" are obviously aligned with normie mentality.

Ignoring the fact that there is massive amounts of fraud and room for crime in the crypto currency space by denigrating the opposing viewpoint doesn't progress the conversation and just keeps the tribalism and fighting at the same levels. If you truly believe in crypto currency, why not try to address the concerns and push crypto currency in a direction that would ensure wider adoption?

"massive" is a subjective term. That statement cannot be a 'fact'. Besides, you could apply the same sentiment, as it relates to 'fraud' and 'room for crime', to the Internet in general.

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#257

Post by redsky880 »

methodical wrote: post #124
beambot wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait till you read about the characters, early failures, and ultimate "success" of the central banking "too big to fail" ponzi scheme. My favorite character is Jonh Law: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Law_(economist)

Great point- these are reasons why we have the regulation we have today in our current banking system, and why any financial system that doesn't have any ability to be regulated (i.e. crypto) is massively problematic and ends up with 99% of people being fleeced out of their assets (as we've seen in the crypto space).

where are you getting this '99%' figure?

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#258

Post by redsky880 »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #82
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I take issue with something about crypto "causes us to lose our minds?". Couple points: 1. At this stage of the game, there is not a lot new under the sun to discuss that is likely to alter people's opinions. I would say that I did think there were some good comments in some of the other posts about what constitutes a security by the legal definition, and helped me understand better the specific points of the SEC's a…

Which boils down to the fact that it's entirely rational to be negative about crypto. Crypto is interesting as a kind of libertarian pseudo-oppositional secular religion that flatters itself that it's edgy and non-conformist but is actually dead-centre mainstream in a capitalist culture with consistent shades of criminality dedicated to making money at any cost.

"entirely rational" is subjective, how can it be a fact?

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#259

Post by redsky880 »

kahnclusions wrote: post #212
thelastparadise wrote: post #24

The quality of discourse at this stage of the thread (2 hours, 20 comments) is incredibly disappointing. Hn usually has high quality discussions. What is it about crypto that causes us to lose our minds?

I think it’s because many people are quite deeply invested in crypto, and the result is that they can be extremely emotional and irrational. Efforts to regulate crypto and make it “not a scam” essentially means they will have wasted tens/hundreds of thousands of dollars and that is embarrassing and shameful. They’re locked into irrationally promoting crypto because it’s the only way to protect their “investments” and…

Lot of assumptions and leaps here. Besides generalizing a group of crypto owners, you are assuming regulation would devalue crypto. Has there been less or more regulation around crypto in the past 10 years? and how has the value of BTC, Ether fared during the past 10 years?

Re: SEC asks for emergency order to freeze Binance US assets anywhere in the world

#260

Post by redsky880 »

btilly wrote: post #144
thelastparadise wrote: post #24

The quality of discourse at this stage of the thread (2 hours, 20 comments) is incredibly disappointing. Hn usually has high quality discussions. What is it about crypto that causes us to lose our minds?

What is it about crypto that causes us to lose our minds? People are unable to have discussions when talking across a divide where people who think one thing think things that cause pain for the other side. If you have money in crypto, you think you're rich. The thought you might not be tends to be painful. If you are in tech and don't have money in crypto, you think crypto is a scam. The thought you missed out tends…

I have money in crypto, but don't think I'm rich. Why try to generalize large groups of people?
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