Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

asahilinux.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 377 posts

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#151

Post by hollerith »

jb1991 wrote: post #39
nightski wrote: post #4

This is great work and I commend it. But in other threads people are acting like Asahi Linux hardware support is 100% complete. My fear is that if I were to go this route and purchase the hardware I'd be seeing fraction of the performance and capability I would in Mac OS. To be honest this blog post seems like the project has a long ways to go, not that it is nearly completion. I just can't justify buying hardware fr…

There have been multiple reports of the last couple years that Apple has been informally internally helping the Asahi Linux team to make it run well on their hardware. Apple cannot come out and officially support another operating system of course, but they are aware of the interest and are helping make it happen, in an unofficial capacity.

>Apple cannot come out and officially support another operating system of course

Apple officially supported running Windows on Macs for many years.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#153

Post by brundolf »

pkulak wrote: post #77
nightski wrote: post #4

This is great work and I commend it. But in other threads people are acting like Asahi Linux hardware support is 100% complete. My fear is that if I were to go this route and purchase the hardware I'd be seeing fraction of the performance and capability I would in Mac OS. To be honest this blog post seems like the project has a long ways to go, not that it is nearly completion. I just can't justify buying hardware fr…

Yeah, I'm not gonna run out and buy a new Macbook just to wipe it. But these M1 machines are going to be things you just have lying around sometime soon. If my wife upgrades, for example, I know exactly what I'm doing with her M1 Air. :D

Asahi is designed to be dual-booted right now (in fact you have to go off the beaten path to not do that), and it even uses the native Apple boot UI to let you pick your OS

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#154

Post by m45t3r »

kaba0 wrote: post #140
m45t3r wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Framework laptops are insanely expensive for again, worse hardware. 1199 EUR is not insanely expensive, specially considering that I can put up-to 64GB of RAM in a Framework laptop with a reasonable amount of money, while I would need to pay almost the price of a full Framework laptop to do the same in a Macbook Pro [1]. This is IMO, insanely expensive. And yes, I can definitely use those amount of memory during ma…

Mind you, the two kinds of RAM are not directly comparable.

Sure, I never said so. It doesn't mean that there isn't workloads that benefit from more RAM (even if it is slower) or that the Apple's RAM prices are insane.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#155

Post by GeekyBear »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #150
GeekyBear wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I really hope Apple brings the same charge limiting to iPhone as well. This was added to iPhones in 2019. > If your iPhone stops charging at 80%, it's most likely due to a feature Apple introduced in iOS 13 called Optimized Battery Charging. It aims to prevent over-stressing the battery and hence extend the battery life of your iPhone by limiting the charge to 80%. Your iPhone learns your usage patterns and delays…

It's a bit different, though. I don't often need my iphone to last multiple days on end. Yet, if I keep it plugged in as often as I'm sitting at a desk, it'll never go below 80%. If I get it below 80%, sooner or later, it will figure "i want to use it" and will charge it all the way to 100%. The lowest my battery ever got on this phone was 40 something when I was away for a weekend without a charger. It's very rare I…

> It's a bit different, though.

Yes.

It learns your normal waking time (if you have one) and gives you a full charge before you wake up.

Which is what I want. A full charge for the working day, without needlessly shortening the batteries functional lifetime.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#156

Post by imiric »

psanford wrote: post #81
imiric wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> at this point there is nothing lacking or unable to run Sure there is. You just haven't run into it yourself. Faster, cooler and more power efficient hardware is great. I just don't think that it makes up for depending on a small team of volunteers to resolve all hardware issues in an ecosystem hostile to OSS, which might break at any point Apple decides to do so. And the incompatibilities with ARM are not negligib…

> depending on a small team of volunteers to resolve all hardware issues in an ecosystem hostile to OSS, which might break at any point Apple decides to do so You are describing how most OSS software has been developed. I don't see how this is any different than early linux when no hardware manufacturers had any interest in supporting it. A lot of the work that the asahi team is doing is just fixing Arm issues in the…

> I don't see how this is any different than early linux when no hardware manufacturers had any interest in supporting it.

It's very different. Hardware manufacturers in the 90s were incentivized to support Linux to expand their customer base. A trillion-dollar corporation has no incentive to sell their hardware to a niche of a niche of technical users who are not part of their software ecosystem.

Another major difference is that Asahi is a small team of dedicated volunteers who want to run Linux on their Macs. They're a niche intersection of Linux hackers and Apple fans. Unsupported hardware in the 90s typically had a much larger customer base and group of hackers willing to spend time adding supporting for it.

Even worse: Apple can decide at any point to make their hardware much more difficult to support. Newer models or firmware updates might break things. Being at the whims of a corporation that is the antithesis of F/LOSS to run Linux on their hardware doesn't inspire confidence.

> Its good for there to be more hardware architecture competition!

> Support for linux/arm will only continue to improve as more people use it.

Agreed. I'm glad that Asahi exists. But we've had ARM Linux distros for decades now. What Asahi is doing is specifically to support Apple hardware. Some improvements will trickle out to improve general ARM support, but this points out the gargantuan task they're actually up against. Not only do they need to reverse engineer the hardware, they have to resolve all software issues with Linux and ARM. My hat's off to them. The willpower, patience and skills required to wade through the absolute mountain of issues must be astronomical. Yet this is also part of my concern; how long can a developer keep the motivation and sanity to swim against the current?

It's great that Asahi works for you and everyone else. I'm just pointing out why it will likely never be my choice for any serious work.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#157

Post by fsflover »

GeekyBear wrote: post #34
nightski wrote: post #4

This is great work and I commend it. But in other threads people are acting like Asahi Linux hardware support is 100% complete. My fear is that if I were to go this route and purchase the hardware I'd be seeing fraction of the performance and capability I would in Mac OS. To be honest this blog post seems like the project has a long ways to go, not that it is nearly completion. I just can't justify buying hardware fr…

You don't create a new bootloader that allows users the freedom to run an unsigned third party OS without having it degrade the system's security if and when they boot the native OS because you are "hostile to developers and hackers".

My laptop can use TPM and a hardware key with my keys and free software. Where is the degraded security?

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#158

Post by dmitrygr »

hedora wrote: post #148
fallat wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure why you're fixated on the whole Linux kernel - we're talking about a small pool of volunteers supporting complex modules. There are good laptops out there other than Macs... Lenovo, HP, Dell, etc all have offerings which are supported out of the box by Linux because they aren't using their own hardware or do contribute the necessary code to run FOSS OSs. I'm not asking you to now dump your Mac. That'd be sil…

> There are good laptops out there other than Macs... Lenovo, HP, Dell, etc all have offerings which are supported out of the box by Linux because they aren't using their own hardware or do contribute the necessary code to run FOSS OSs. For the love of all that is holy, name one model that has the following properties: - 6 hours real life battery doing C++ development work. - 7+ days suspend battery life - 99.99% suc…

Installing "uBar" fixed a lot of my beef with MacOS. (I get no referral bonus, just a happy user)

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#159

Post by thx-2718 »

m45t3r wrote: post #154
kaba0 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mind you, the two kinds of RAM are not directly comparable.

Sure, I never said so. It doesn't mean that there isn't workloads that benefit from more RAM (even if it is slower) or that the Apple's RAM prices are insane.

Not to mention I can't find anything on them having ECC capabilities but I could be wrong.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#160

Post by vladvasiliu »

GeekyBear wrote: post #155
vladvasiliu wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a bit different, though. I don't often need my iphone to last multiple days on end. Yet, if I keep it plugged in as often as I'm sitting at a desk, it'll never go below 80%. If I get it below 80%, sooner or later, it will figure "i want to use it" and will charge it all the way to 100%. The lowest my battery ever got on this phone was 40 something when I was away for a weekend without a charger. It's very rare I…

> It's a bit different, though. Yes. It learns your normal waking time (if you have one) and gives you a full charge before you wake up. Which is what I want. A full charge for the working day, without needlessly shortening the batteries functional lifetime.

Sure, but if I know I won't drain my battery more than 10% that day, I can't tell it not to top it up more than 80%. That's the case for me 99.9% of days.

This also seems to work only if you've drained the battery below 80%. If it says 90% and I plug it in? It'll charge it fully right away.

Post reply on HN