Where I live, schools employ smart devices as part of the class teaching from grade 1. So that's that.
The Wait Until 8th pledge
121–130 of 254 posts
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#122Strange. I did not have a cellphone until I was 19. I grew up to be just fine. My kid now almost 8. Does not ask for a cellphone. Kids need to be kids and have fun in other way. One thing that worked for me is I give them broken devices (electronics) and see if they can fix it. Nothing fancy. We usually go to goodwill or some after hand market. If they fix it they sell it. We do occasionally play Minecraft on a local…
Note that the campaign is wait until "8th" (grade), not until 8 years old. I didn't have a cellphone in school either, because no one did, but that's not the situation anymore.
Even better. Hah.
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#123Strange. I did not have a cellphone until I was 19. I grew up to be just fine. My kid now almost 8. Does not ask for a cellphone. Kids need to be kids and have fun in other way. One thing that worked for me is I give them broken devices (electronics) and see if they can fix it. Nothing fancy. We usually go to goodwill or some after hand market. If they fix it they sell it. We do occasionally play Minecraft on a local…
> I did not have a cellphone until I was 19. I grew up to be just fine. Did you grow up in a world where most other kids had them and fluency with smartphone use was expected?
I migrated to the state from a poor country. But I get it kids are way more exposed now vs what I was back a decade ago.
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#124Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's cool you, a tech-savvy HN poster, has managed to wield technology to find a high-reward/low-risk way to parent using devices, but perhaps your 'correct' solution may not work in all contexts for all people. Perhaps you just have a kid who has the right temperament to handle devices when young. Perhaps you work few enough hours or have the resources necessary to parent in a way to make this work. Perhaps the ki…
well, I am not telling everyone should do the same as me. I just don't want someone telling me that I should not do it. Because that's the final goal of such movements: start with "voluntary pledges", move into social stigmatization of dissidents, capture organizational rule, and then, finally, the law. The same script as the prohibition. It is an inexorable and fairly predictable movement, probably a cultural herita…
This is a fair concern. I have thought about bringing this to the attention of our school board, so that they can publicize it. But I wouldn't want it to be done in a heavy-handed way that implied that 'good parents' wait until 8th.
We need to recognize that different kids may have different needs based on how they get to/from school or extracurriculars, for example. But in the US, I don't see there being much of a risk that kids having smartphones would be stigmatized...the current rate of adoption is quite high, and it's seen as a sign of wealth/status.
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
it's pretty easy to use parental controls to block such apps.
Yeah, but "easy" is relative. A lot of people out there really only know how to use their phone to browse social media. This doesn't stop them from becoming parents.
well, organizing an educational campaign and using activism to pressure the industry shouldn't be much harder than organizing this campaign for what is essentially a temperance pledge.
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't even buy that it's less safe to play outside, but parents refuse to let their kids do it and those that do have occasionally faced problems with police and child services for doing what parents have allowed their kids to do for generations. It's no surprise kids are turning to screens when they aren't allowed to walk to school let alone ride a bike with friends or go to a park on their own. I also agree that…
It can be less safe in part because there are fewer eyes on the street. If everyone has a lot of kids and a lot of those kids are outside together playing stick ball or whatever, it's much less likely one of them will be molested, kidnapped, etc.
I suspect that's true, more eyes would help, but honestly the greatest risk to kids from kidnappers and molesters has always come from their own families and other adults close to the family, and not strangers lurking in playgrounds. Some people are in areas with high crime rates (lots of gang violence for example) but mostly cities are safer than ever. It's nice when you've got a real community of people who know each other, and can watch out for each other. Houses kids know they can run to because some adult they can trust will probably be there to help them if they knock. There were some elderly folks like that in my neighborhood when I grew up. We'd stop by for drinks and to chat as kids. If someone got hurt, or we needed something we always had places to turn to. I don't even know who my neighbors are these days.
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#127I think many commenters can’t see forest for the trees.
As with most of domains there’s a curve of speciality. Most of the “don’t ever do that” is aimed for general population.
I believe it’s as with the cotton swabs. While there’s a lot of evidence cleaning ears is not dangerous, doctors don’t want Joe Average - armed with any form of a stick - anywhere near an eardrum.
I agree with a general sentiment about restricting screen time but I myself won’t be following it. I think the problem is the social media and not the screen time per se (which seems to be equalized and for good cause, because Average Jane probably don’t know the difference) and I’m holding out as much as I can threading a line between my kids being ostracized by their peers and endangering their mental health.
There are also other things in consideration. There’s ADHD, there’s ASD, there’s full blown autism. Those together aren’t that uncommon and creates a fair share of kids with different needs - that might have vastly different use of the device with completely different outcome (Many of IT specialists were, after all, hyper focusing on coding or systems or other kind of geeky stuff when they were young).
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#128Giving a smartphone to a child is creating a lot of problems. In Korea, many parents play YouTube videos to their whining children, and many wonder if this is contributing to the rise in ADHD in children. Parents and the government must make a decision before a bigger social problem arises.
If everyone has ADHD, is it really a disorder anymore? I say this because I have ADHD. Diagnosed very late, because it never bothered me… I just used it to my advantage all my life and I never understood how people can spend years in the same place with the same job. That, to me, sounds like the real sickness. I learned more about it since and of course there’s a spectrum to it, but still. ADHD is no doubt the #1 fac…
Are we talking about the same disorder? The inability to concentrate on thing that don't immediately pique my interest has costed me quite a lot. Had I gotten diagnosed and medicated earlier, I feel like I could have finished my Bachelor's, or keep my last job, or get a driver's license.
I was shocked to find out that the concentration capabilities I have while high on Adderall are considered just normal for most people.
I still think the root of the problem lies in the insane amount of work hours we're expected to put out, and I'm sure that I would have an easier time if tech companies (that I can score a job in) actually made something real rather than adtech bullshit jobs. But until then...
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
It can be less safe in part because there are fewer eyes on the street. If everyone has a lot of kids and a lot of those kids are outside together playing stick ball or whatever, it's much less likely one of them will be molested, kidnapped, etc.
I suspect that's true, more eyes would help, but honestly the greatest risk to kids from kidnappers and molesters has always come from their own families and other adults close to the family, and not strangers lurking in playgrounds. Some people are in areas with high crime rates (lots of gang violence for example) but mostly cities are safer than ever. It's nice when you've got a real community of people who know ea…
I'm aware of those stats. Rest assured, molestation tends to happen in private, without witnesses.
It also means if a kid gets hurt, someone can run get a grown up. They aren't stuck somewhere unable to get help with no witnesses.
Re: The Wait Until 8th pledge
#130In Denmark we are on the brink of banning smartphones in schools. Not because we want to but because all the science point toward them being dangerous. I’m personally not on the hardliner side, but I’ve yet to see a single argument as to why children need to have access to a smartphone during class except for cases of accessibility. All of the pro phones in school voices in the debate here are from the tech industry…
> I plan on doing something similar with my children
You plan to go to a public library to show them a video in which a picture of Pamela Anderson in a swimsuit is appearing line by line?