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Apple Virtualization Framework

developer.apple.com

111–120 of 127 posts

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#111

VirtualBuddy is a great open-source project that takes advantage of this framework: https://github.com/insidegui/VirtualBuddy

Orbstack is a relatively new player that offers both VMs and containerization on top of the virtualization framework: https://orbstack.dev

Side note: It's free for now but will be a paid service later.

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#112
post #82

This is not news, right? And there was not any significant updates recently? So it is upvoted just because, right? This is not a rhetorical question, I am trying to understand if I missed something important.

I quickly glanced over docs and didn't find anything new since 2022. So it seems that nothing new indeed. Hopefully in a few weeks something new will appear.

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#114
post #52
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s noble, but open source doesn’t always deliver the same benefits of COTS products, such as stability and support. That trumps ideology for many people and businesses.

Definitely true. But I also feel like open source stuff is more honest about the capabilities. That's important to me and often trumps the marketing effort by a commercial effort.

On that thread, many vendors will implement features and capabilities through request or with with their customers, and often at their own expense if it increases their overall marketability.

Sure, you could put in a request to the project maintainer, fork it - or find a contribution yourself - but there will still be zero guarantees and support arrangements will be shaky at best.

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#115
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we can’t have native macOS on the iPad this would be the next best thing. Imagine having Linux or macOS on the iPad that is treated like any other app (sans memory limits and etc.). You could have a full blown desktop at the ready when iPadOS isn’t up to the task. The iPad could finally utilize the m1 processor to its fullest.

FWIW this is how it works on ChromeOS today. From the Linux terminal app (crostini lxc container) qemu launches macOS, Windows and Linux vms. They even support nested virtualization on my Framework Chromebook - so vms can run inside those vms. I agree if Apple implemented virtualization on iPad/iPhone this same way it would be a huge for unlocking their full usefulness and capabilities while still maintaining host is…

The irony of a monolithic kernel to use containers and VMs inside VMs all over the place.

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#116
post #99

I use Virtualization.framework for OrbStack ( https://orbstack.dev ), which is a Docker Desktop and WSL alternative. It's great overall, and fairly convenient, but it has a fair share of bugs and limitations. The Virtualization service crashes with various combinations of Linux kernel version, macOS version, and architecture (ARM/Intel), so making it stable in each setup takes quite a bit of work. Device support is l…

> OrbStack (https://orbstack.dev), which is a Docker Desktop and WSL alternative

Wait why have I never heard of this? I just tried it out and it seems to work amazingly well.

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cool! What’s the difference between Virtualisation.framework and Hypervisor.framework?

AFAIK Virtualization.framework is built on top of Hypervisor.framework. Former is high-level one allowing you to create Linux VM with few hundreds lines of code. Latter allows you to run your whatever you want with few tens of thousands lines of code, but absolute freedom when it comes to drivers and every low level detail.

Very cool thanks!

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#118
post #99

I use Virtualization.framework for OrbStack ( https://orbstack.dev ), which is a Docker Desktop and WSL alternative. It's great overall, and fairly convenient, but it has a fair share of bugs and limitations. The Virtualization service crashes with various combinations of Linux kernel version, macOS version, and architecture (ARM/Intel), so making it stable in each setup takes quite a bit of work. Device support is l…

> OrbStack ( https://orbstack.dev ), which is a Docker Desktop and WSL alternative Wait why have I never heard of this? I just tried it out and it seems to work amazingly well.

Glad to hear that!

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeaahhh ... the secure enclave seems to have pooched the idea of a USB stick booter. Restore Mode works fine. Maybe I misunderstood you, but you can make a bootable USB stick from the installer app: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372

Nah. That's not the issue. The issue is cloning my system, so I can basically have a portable workstation on a USB stick. It's been a while, since that was possible. The M-series just basically put a fork in it. That, and CCC kept crashing the machine.

For cloning systems and making them bootable, the official option is to use Apple Software Restore (asr in the Terminal). CCC uses that under the hood though, so it might crash your system as well.

Re: Apple Virtualization Framework

#120
post #99

I use Virtualization.framework for OrbStack ( https://orbstack.dev ), which is a Docker Desktop and WSL alternative. It's great overall, and fairly convenient, but it has a fair share of bugs and limitations. The Virtualization service crashes with various combinations of Linux kernel version, macOS version, and architecture (ARM/Intel), so making it stable in each setup takes quite a bit of work. Device support is l…

> OrbStack ( https://orbstack.dev ), which is a Docker Desktop and WSL alternative Wait why have I never heard of this? I just tried it out and it seems to work amazingly well.

I've been using OrbStack for a few weeks now and, while initially skeptical that I would in future consider paying for it, now I think I would. I've found it to be less troublesome than Docker desktop, has some prettier terminal output, and it starts up and quits so fast. These might seem like small quality of life improvements, but added together it's just a lot nicer to use. Looking forward to seeing where it goes next.
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