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Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

chrlschn.medium.com

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Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#11

Post by firecall »

agufal wrote: post #4

Every time I try to do something with modern JS I'm reminded of this blog post ( https://peterxjang.com/blog/modern-javascript-explained-for-... ) And also every time I end up giving up because it's so damn complex

It’s bonkers. I’m sure there is some sort of collective delusion.

I’m currently fixing a React app for client. I’m convinced the previous “Dev Team” had no idea how it all actually worked.

It’s all so fragile they seemed to never be able to change anything with breaking something.

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#12

Post by dingle_thunk »

waboremo wrote: post #10
dingle_thunk wrote: post #7

With H/3, modern frameworks have become unnecessary deviations from web standards that result in high costs and lower app lifetimes. Do standard server side work, don’t use node as a server, sprinkle a bit of typescript where needed, and keep things lean. As a recovering front end developer of 20 years, someone who has played with every damn framework and used most of them professionally; just stick to web standards…

Your example does not align with your closing statement. Using Arc is certainly not "sticking to web standards" in the way you're proposing. HN is simple and works, from a user perspective. I don't have my hands on the codebase, but I imagine it's kind of fun to work on precisely because it isn't "close to the metal". DX is just as important as UX is, you have to strike a balance. Not sure there's much correlation be…

GWT and Facebook’s PHP stack were both effectively server side technologies. GWT was pretty awful, but angular is probably the worst of the bunch when it comes to front end frameworks too. What I’m saying is you should run your app on the server and use HTML as a presentation layer. This is standard, it gives you visibility into bugs, it simplifies the end user payload, and it works quickly and reliably without needing huge refactoring projects and complex abstractions that your business does not need.

You probably don’t need a front end stack. You should just use the web standards as designed first, and then add improvements that customers like.

Developers wasting time on unnecessary fripperies is not a new thing: https://youtu.be/wHdHCoeUbU4

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#13

Post by paulddraper »

dingle_thunk wrote: post #7

With H/3, modern frameworks have become unnecessary deviations from web standards that result in high costs and lower app lifetimes. Do standard server side work, don’t use node as a server, sprinkle a bit of typescript where needed, and keep things lean. As a recovering front end developer of 20 years, someone who has played with every damn framework and used most of them professionally; just stick to web standards…

Imagine using HN as the model for web software projects.

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#14

Post by paulddraper »

FractalHQ wrote: post #3

Svelte is still the best by just about every metric that matters. The consensus seems to be clear that once you get a real taste of the Svelte DX, everything else is a downgrade.

Could someone explain to me the biggest differences between Svelte and Angular?

I looked into Svelte when it was first emerging and at the time it seemed a reinvented Angular.

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#15

Post by paulddraper »

> Next.js is having a moment and likely to be the platform of choice for the foreseeable near- and mid-term future in both the enterprise and startup space because React on its own is too un-opinionated and therefore, somewhat open to being misused, mis-configured, and poorly architected since there are many choices involved in any non-trivial implementation..

Lolol all those people who said React was superior to backbone, angular, etc because it was a library not a framework.

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#16

Post by pcthrowaway »

FractalHQ wrote: post #3

Svelte is still the best by just about every metric that matters. The consensus seems to be clear that once you get a real taste of the Svelte DX, everything else is a downgrade.

I don't know that I prefer Sveltekit over Nextjs yet, but Svelte vs React is quite nice.

But I might still use React for large projects with many components if it doesn't need animations/transitions, and the global/shared state is pretty lightweight

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#17

Post by dingle_thunk »

paulddraper wrote: post #13
dingle_thunk wrote: post #7

With H/3, modern frameworks have become unnecessary deviations from web standards that result in high costs and lower app lifetimes. Do standard server side work, don’t use node as a server, sprinkle a bit of typescript where needed, and keep things lean. As a recovering front end developer of 20 years, someone who has played with every damn framework and used most of them professionally; just stick to web standards…

Imagine using HN as the model for web software projects.

You've been here since 2014. How much value have you derived from this code? How long would it take you to write it? https://news.ycombinator.com/hn.js

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#18

Post by solarkraft »

pcthrowaway wrote: post #16
FractalHQ wrote: post #3

Svelte is still the best by just about every metric that matters. The consensus seems to be clear that once you get a real taste of the Svelte DX, everything else is a downgrade.

I don't know that I prefer Sveltekit over Nextjs yet, but Svelte vs React is quite nice. But I might still use React for large projects with many components if it doesn't need animations/transitions, and the global/shared state is pretty lightweight

What would be your motivation to pick React? I'd say the ecosystem.

You're really hitting a point there with the animations. Framer is cool and all, but animating exits still sucks.

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#19

Post by graftak »

firecall wrote: post #11
agufal wrote: post #4

Every time I try to do something with modern JS I'm reminded of this blog post ( https://peterxjang.com/blog/modern-javascript-explained-for-... ) And also every time I end up giving up because it's so damn complex

It’s bonkers. I’m sure there is some sort of collective delusion. I’m currently fixing a React app for client. I’m convinced the previous “Dev Team” had no idea how it all actually worked. It’s all so fragile they seemed to never be able to change anything with breaking something.

Just imagine what those devs would make without a framework.

Re: Thoughts on React vs. Vue vs. Everything Else in 2023

#20

Post by noman-land »

graftak wrote: post #19
firecall wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s bonkers. I’m sure there is some sort of collective delusion. I’m currently fixing a React app for client. I’m convinced the previous “Dev Team” had no idea how it all actually worked. It’s all so fragile they seemed to never be able to change anything with breaking something.

Just imagine what those devs would make without a framework.

No framework is going to teach someone how to design a complex application that not only does everything it's supposed to, but does it well, and lends itself well to extension and modification over time by a constantly changing array of people. That takes years of experience, an excellent engineering culture and a well designed infrastructure.

You can't expect React to do that. It's just a tool.

React takes a developer from zero to one very quickly, but the rest is the craft.

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