Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#1

Post by behnamoh » Sun, May 28, 2023, 8:23 PM UTC

I've been programming in high-level languages for a while and recently I was thinking about learning something more bare metal. Rust stood out as one of the popular C/C++ alternatives. But for me, the investment in a language is driven by not just the beauty of the language itself, but the community around it.

As an outsider who's keeping an eye on Rust, am I better off sticking to vanilla C/C++?

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#2

Post by daviddever23box » Sun, May 28, 2023, 8:33 PM UTC

IMHO, one should make one's language choices based on utility and NOT solely on metacharacteristics such as quality of governance, DEI efforts, or nation of origin. None of these things matter when the program is run, if the process and end result do not solve the problem(s) at hand.

Thorough feature discussion, appropriate licensing, and accessibility of source code for risk evaluation are metacharacteristics that are relevant.

And-lest anyone think that, as a white cisgender male born in America, I have no skin in the game, it is my belief that any interactions with others ought to be principled on transparent rigor and mutual respect, from which all other things should flow.

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#3

Post by revskill » Sun, May 28, 2023, 8:35 PM UTC

I found programming in Rust is fun. The std library provides efficient implementation for your need, which made your time spent worth it.

Whatever your goal is, it's worth your time as i see it.

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#4

Post by jareds » Sun, May 28, 2023, 8:54 PM UTC

daviddever23box wrote: post #2

IMHO, one should make one's language choices based on utility and NOT solely on metacharacteristics such as quality of governance, DEI efforts, or nation of origin. None of these things matter when the program is run, if the process and end result do not solve the problem(s) at hand. Thorough feature discussion, appropriate licensing, and accessibility of source code for risk evaluation are metacharacteristics that a…

I was not aware that there are any recent issues with the Rust community since I don't use Rust. while technical characteristics of a language are important the ability of a community to continue supporting the language for the long term is also important. Go has Google backing it, Java has Oracle backing it, etc. Is there enough corporate use of Rust that if the current Rust community falls apart someone will create a stable version of the language and toolchain that will be maintained and updated?

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#5

Post by Lariscus » Sun, May 28, 2023, 8:58 PM UTC

Every community has its fair share of drama. I wouldn't worry too much about such things.

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#6

Post by version_five » Sun, May 28, 2023, 9:08 PM UTC

daviddever23box wrote: post #2

IMHO, one should make one's language choices based on utility and NOT solely on metacharacteristics such as quality of governance, DEI efforts, or nation of origin. None of these things matter when the program is run, if the process and end result do not solve the problem(s) at hand. Thorough feature discussion, appropriate licensing, and accessibility of source code for risk evaluation are metacharacteristics that a…

solely

I agree with that, but that stuff you mention is still a factor. Politics is creeping into everything, and there are lots of reasons why choosing a relatively politically stable language is important, though obviously not the only factor. I think the best one could hope for is a lot of diverse groups with different political views and motivations being invested in the future of a language, so that despite any culture war stuff, there's likely to be a useful version that survives.

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#7

Post by bjourne » Sun, May 28, 2023, 9:08 PM UTC

Community drama is a terrible way to evaluate a language.

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#8

Post by Gibbon1 » Sun, May 28, 2023, 9:44 PM UTC

bjourne wrote: post #7

Community drama is a terrible way to evaluate a language.

Software already has a big problem with toxic childish behaviors.

I asked my mom who used to audit businesses what was important about founders and CEO's and she said they more than anyone else set the companies culture. I feels to me like that seems to be true of the culture surrounding various programming langs.

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#9

Post by daviddever23box » Sun, May 28, 2023, 10:02 PM UTC

version_five wrote: post #6

daviddever23box wrote: post #2

IMHO, one should make one's language choices based on utility and NOT solely on metacharacteristics such as quality of governance, DEI efforts, or nation of origin. None of these things matter when the program is run, if the process and end result do not solve the problem(s) at hand. Thorough feature discussion, appropriate licensing, and accessibility of source code for risk evaluation are metacharacteristics that a…

solely I agree with that, but that stuff you mention is still a factor. Politics is creeping into everything, and there are lots of reasons why choosing a relatively politically stable language is important, though obviously not the only factor. I think the best one could hope for is a lot of diverse groups with different political views and motivations being invested in the future of a language, so that despite any…

Microsoft and Alphabet have plenty of motivation to keep things on track, as does the Linux Foundation and others. I suspect that, if things get completely out of hand, that corporate sponsors might impress their will upon the Rust Foundation to address any issues around governance.

Politics will creep into anything, if one allows that to happen.

Re: Ask HN: Is Rust worth investing in as a reliable C-alt given its recent saga?

#10

Post by marginalia_nu » Sun, May 28, 2023, 10:15 PM UTC

bjourne wrote: post #7

Community drama is a terrible way to evaluate a language.

A decent metric for community maturity though. That absolutely should be a factor in deciding on a language.

I'm having a real hard time seeing this unfold among the greybeards that call the shots in Java or C++.