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Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

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Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#101

Post by naikrovek »

asveikau wrote: post #35
routerl wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Really shitty of Nintendo to sunset the console and then close the door behind them on the way out. The age of abandonware[0] is over. The promise of future earnings from streaming/downloads means all major content producers will lock down even out-of-print works, like consoles from previous generations. This is just another casualty of the fight we were having 20 years ago, re: copyright. We lost. It's over. [0] h…

I feel like it probably costs them very little to keep every title listed for sale. They could be making revenue from it. Probably not as much as when the stuff was new, but something. I guess by cutting off supply of the old stuff, though, they can do re-releases and re-masters charging somewhat similar to the price of a new game, or get people to pay a monthly subscription fee for access.

it would cost them very little to keep things online but very little is too much, sometimes.

I would GLADLY pay Nintendo for every ROM I want but do not have, if they would only take my money and sell it.

they choose not to sell. so I feel it is, at a minimum, borderline ok to pirate things that aren't sold anymore. I would give my money, but these companies will not take it.

this is where music downloads were in 2002 or so. maybe a bit later. people were pirating like crazy and record companies would not give users what they wanted: the ability to listen to what they wanted where they wanted.

most pirates (those who don't consider piracy itself a hobby, anyway) don't really want to pirate; they want to play a game, or hear a song, or watch a TV show or movie when they want. They want on-demand access to the things they enjoy. they will gladly pay if only the copyright owners would accept the money, but often they won't.

so the users take things into their own hands. I'm ok with it. but I'm no one and no media company will ever listen to me so whatever.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#102

Post by naikrovek »

blairbeckwith wrote: post #83
asveikau wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like it probably costs them very little to keep every title listed for sale. They could be making revenue from it. Probably not as much as when the stuff was new, but something. I guess by cutting off supply of the old stuff, though, they can do re-releases and re-masters charging somewhat similar to the price of a new game, or get people to pay a monthly subscription fee for access.

If they had kept Super Mario 64 and/or Super Mario Sunshine and/or Super Mario Galaxy available for sale since their consoles were discontinued, Nintendo wouldn’t have sold 9 million+ copies of Super Mario 3D All Stars. I bet they make more from re-releasing ports of “vault” titles than they would keeping them for sale forever.

> If they had kept Super Mario 64 and/or Super Mario Sunshine and/or Super Mario Galaxy available for sale since their consoles were discontinued, Nintendo wouldn’t have sold 9 million+ copies of Super Mario 3D All Stars.

I think they would have. those games are all available on the 2nd hand market easily. I don't mind paying for remasters of games I already own for older hardware, anyway, because remasters are not a big expense for me and by buying remasters I send my vote that I want remasters.

I mean, it's Nintendo's IP. they can do what they want. I think the way they do things is very short-sighted, though.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#103

Post by Sohcahtoa82 »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #54
jeroenhd wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keeping stuff for sale can be expensive because of licensed assets. Licensed music has taken games down before and it will again. I don't know the publisher contracts Nintendo signs, but if there's a time duration in the contract, that may open up a very expensive "deal with keeping track of which developers relicensed their games" problem. That said, I 100% believe this is just a way for them to make sure you can't…

> Very expensive "deal with keeping track of which developers relicensed their games" problem. There is tons of licensing issues in the gaming industry under the surface that causes problems all over the place. An extreme example would be Sega's mistakes with Sonic. Sonic 3 , despite not having him in the credits, contains some works by Michael Jackson. That has complicated things tremendously in re-releases, so much…

> Guess why the Sonic movies don't have almost any soundtracks or sound effects from the game? According to the Directors, it wasn't a thematic choice, but a legal one.

Why is this a thing? I've heard of game studios having a movie studio make a movie, but then not allow them to use certain elements from the game. It ruins the movie, IMO, and I've never understood why game studios knee-cap movie adaptations like that.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#104

Post by Cyph0n »

surgical_fire wrote: post #82
lostgame wrote: post #18

I replied to a comment on some other Nintendo-related post here the other day that began with something like ‘…Nintendo isn’t petty enough to…’ - to which I jokingly replied that I’d stopped reading after that. Honestly - Nintendo is the pettiest and shittiest to its incredibly passionate fan base. Where SEGA hires people who have created great fan content, for instance; Nintendo sends out C&D’s. Nintendo shut off th…

> Nintendo is the pettiest and shittiest to its incredibly passionate fan base. Eh... Not really? I mean, what are we even complaining about here? That a company did some minor step (in a too little too late fashion) to block their old console, that everyone and their dog already hacked? And even still, how does it impede the homebrew people? Plenty of emulators for every Nintendo console available anyway. And let's…

If you really think Nintendo isn’t extremely petty, read up on how they deal with the Super Smash Bros competitive scene.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#105

Post by downWidOutaFite »

BowBun wrote: post #20
zachruss92 wrote: post #15

This is a very Nintendo thing to do. I get it from a business perspective but it’s an easy way to really alienate a loyal audience.

And yet they've been antagonistic towards the modding/piracy community since the beginning and have one of the most loyal fan bases of any gaming brand. How do you explain that?

It's basically the Disney business model, still mining nostalgic brands from 40 years ago. As a parent I was lucky that I didn't have that nostalgia factor to make me push it onto my kids. I got a Switch based on their "family friendly" reputation, saw how scummy they are with re-releases, random subscription fees, and periodically locking down old games on their emulator, and decided I didn't want to make my kid become nostalgic to that corporate abuse in their future. That's at least one generational nostalgia chain cutoff, but there are many million others out there.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#106

Post by surgical_fire »

Cyph0n wrote: post #104
surgical_fire wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nintendo is the pettiest and shittiest to its incredibly passionate fan base. Eh... Not really? I mean, what are we even complaining about here? That a company did some minor step (in a too little too late fashion) to block their old console, that everyone and their dog already hacked? And even still, how does it impede the homebrew people? Plenty of emulators for every Nintendo console available anyway. And let's…

If you really think Nintendo isn’t extremely petty, read up on how they deal with the Super Smash Bros competitive scene.

I am aware of it. And I don't think it's petty.

It's almost ironic. Blizzard tried multiple times (and failed) to create some title that made a breakthrough in the e-sports scene.

Nintendo on the other hand had something without even trying, and could have monetized it to no end. But they decided to keep away from it, and took some effort to shutdown the usage of their IP for it.

I can sort of understand the rationale. They are very careful with how their brands are used. Contrary to other videogame companies, Nintendo lives and dies on their brands and IPs. It's their biggest asset, and the only thing ensuring they remain meaningful.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#107

Post by giancarlostoro »

spondylosaurus wrote: post #5

The good news is that it looks like this new patch won't affect anyone who always has Luma3DS custom firmware installed, and there are other methods for hacking your 3DS, but they're a lot more convoluted. The bannerbomb3 method was super easy and essentially foolproof. Really shitty of Nintendo to sunset the console and then close the door behind them on the way out. Homebrew communities have been doing their damned…

I never understood why they harshly crack down on homebrew. Pirated games sure, but homebrew? Maybe they dont want parents finding their kids downloaded some R-rated homebrew content?

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#108

Post by CodesInChaos »

Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #103
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Very expensive "deal with keeping track of which developers relicensed their games" problem. There is tons of licensing issues in the gaming industry under the surface that causes problems all over the place. An extreme example would be Sega's mistakes with Sonic. Sonic 3 , despite not having him in the credits, contains some works by Michael Jackson. That has complicated things tremendously in re-releases, so much…

> Guess why the Sonic movies don't have almost any soundtracks or sound effects from the game? According to the Directors, it wasn't a thematic choice, but a legal one. Why is this a thing? I've heard of game studios having a movie studio make a movie, but then not allow them to use certain elements from the game. It ruins the movie, IMO, and I've never understood why game studios knee-cap movie adaptations like that…

Probably because the game studio licensed those assets from a third party, and that license doesn't cover a movie adaption.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#109

Post by bdw5204 »

bombcar wrote: post #94
JoshTriplett wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have people building games today that use works under license learned this lesson and purchased perpetual licenses, or are they still trying to save money by purchasing narrow licenses that don't work for re-releases or remakes or similar?

Some agencies understand games now and sell appropriately priced perpetual licenses. Others still treat a game like a moderatly long one time performance.

If the agency won't offer a perpetual license at a reasonable price, their content shouldn't be included in the game. It's inexcusable that games are still being removed from sale in a medium where the cost of manufacturing a copy is 0 because the makers of the game signed a bad contract on some minor piece of content in the game and don't want to be bothered removing it.

Re: Nintendo updates 3DS to block Bannerbomb3 despite eShop discontinuation

#110

Post by m4rtink »

jeroenhd wrote: post #51
asveikau wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like it probably costs them very little to keep every title listed for sale. They could be making revenue from it. Probably not as much as when the stuff was new, but something. I guess by cutting off supply of the old stuff, though, they can do re-releases and re-masters charging somewhat similar to the price of a new game, or get people to pay a monthly subscription fee for access.

Keeping stuff for sale can be expensive because of licensed assets. Licensed music has taken games down before and it will again. I don't know the publisher contracts Nintendo signs, but if there's a time duration in the contract, that may open up a very expensive "deal with keeping track of which developers relicensed their games" problem. That said, I 100% believe this is just a way for them to make sure you can't…

So basically another case study why modern copyright law is broken ?
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