Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012) • Hacker News Board

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#521

Post by linsomniac » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:04 PM UTC

henrikschroder wrote: post #192

isaacfrond wrote: post #131

My sister in law writes recipes. She has a recipe column in a newspaper and wrote a few high quality recipe books. I saw them in a bookstore. So she's reasonable successful. Her pieces are charming, her recipes inspiring. The thing is. At a birthday party when I was talking to her, she confessed to me that she never actually tries her recipes. When it's time to do a new piece, she sits down at her computer and makes…

As if I needed more fuel on the fire of my burning hatred for recipe collections. Everyone who is interested in cooking should do themselves a favour and buy a proper cookbook. Something that starts with the basics, and works itself up to full meals. It should have cheat-sheets for basic ways to cook all your staples, here's all the ways you can cook a potato, with times and temperature. Here's all the ways you can s…

I have a very well worn copy of The Joy of Cooking and highly recommend it. I rarely use it these days, but I've also built up a lot of cooking instinct and I'll usually just look up 3-4 recipes and combine the parts I like from each.

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#522

Post by ianai » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:05 PM UTC

henrikschroder wrote: post #192

isaacfrond wrote: post #131

My sister in law writes recipes. She has a recipe column in a newspaper and wrote a few high quality recipe books. I saw them in a bookstore. So she's reasonable successful. Her pieces are charming, her recipes inspiring. The thing is. At a birthday party when I was talking to her, she confessed to me that she never actually tries her recipes. When it's time to do a new piece, she sits down at her computer and makes…

As if I needed more fuel on the fire of my burning hatred for recipe collections. Everyone who is interested in cooking should do themselves a favour and buy a proper cookbook. Something that starts with the basics, and works itself up to full meals. It should have cheat-sheets for basic ways to cook all your staples, here's all the ways you can cook a potato, with times and temperature. Here's all the ways you can s…

Alton Brown was really good for this.

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#523

Post by Nathanael_M » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:06 PM UTC

There actually is a way to get deeply caramelized onions quickly. Ripping hot pan, start with a bit of water. Then it's just a pattern of sear, deglaze with water, sear, deglaze with water. Repeat until level of caramelization required is achieved. You won't get it in 10 minutes, but it's VASTLY quicker.

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#524

Post by SamBam » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:07 PM UTC

pbj1968 wrote: post #20

Sifting flour. Sautéing spices “to release the flavor” and then adding them to stew where they’ll simmer for an hour or more. Pretending “restaurant quality” is anything besides twice as much butter and salt as you’d dare use at home. “One tablespoon of olive oil” to brown absurd amounts of meat at high heat. Once you start recognizing recipe BS, you see it everywhere.

Plenty of spices distribute their flavors better in oils/fats than in water.

Take some szechuan peppercorns and boil them in a soup and see if you feel the ma numbing sensation. Then saute them in oil for a few minutes and then add the soup, and notice the difference.

It's the same with lots of spices.

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#525

Post by safety1st » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:07 PM UTC

henrikschroder wrote: post #192

isaacfrond wrote: post #131

My sister in law writes recipes. She has a recipe column in a newspaper and wrote a few high quality recipe books. I saw them in a bookstore. So she's reasonable successful. Her pieces are charming, her recipes inspiring. The thing is. At a birthday party when I was talking to her, she confessed to me that she never actually tries her recipes. When it's time to do a new piece, she sits down at her computer and makes…

As if I needed more fuel on the fire of my burning hatred for recipe collections. Everyone who is interested in cooking should do themselves a favour and buy a proper cookbook. Something that starts with the basics, and works itself up to full meals. It should have cheat-sheets for basic ways to cook all your staples, here's all the ways you can cook a potato, with times and temperature. Here's all the ways you can s…

Very amateur cook here and I never thought about this before, but I can see your point.

When I follow a recipe it may or may not turn out well. If the recipe is a bad one or there's a part of it which requires a technique I don't know, the end product won't be good.

When I learn a technique it opens up a variety of options for just creating delicious stuff. A good example was learning how to make a pan sauce. Suddenly a bunch of things lying around the kitchen became ingredients for whatever kind of delicious sauce I was in the mood for, accompanying pretty much any meat or vegetable I wanted to eat. Dozens of possibilities for making great meals all came from one technique.

When you learn the techniques you end up with tons of options for what you're going to cook and the end product turns out better because you understand why it works.

I'd be a lot more hesitant about adopting this approach to baking though!

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#526

Post by zebraflask » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:10 PM UTC

isaacfrond wrote: post #131

My sister in law writes recipes. She has a recipe column in a newspaper and wrote a few high quality recipe books. I saw them in a bookstore. So she's reasonable successful. Her pieces are charming, her recipes inspiring. The thing is. At a birthday party when I was talking to her, she confessed to me that she never actually tries her recipes. When it's time to do a new piece, she sits down at her computer and makes…

Aha, I've often vaguely suspected as much with certain well-known food columns. I wrote it off to incompetent cooks, but it makes more sense that they were just making it up as they went along.

One that sticks in my mind was a recipe that called for a dozen whole cloves, where really you'd just use one or two. If any.

A dozen whole cloves, used in the way the recipe called for, would make pretty much any dish painfully inedible.

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#527

Post by smcl » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:10 PM UTC

throwawaaarrgh wrote: post #496

smcl wrote: post #224

I talk about cooking and food a lot with my Czech teacher (not just because I like to cook, but if I'm low-energy it's such an easy topic) and I brought this idea up - something along the lines of "What do you think about all the recipes that say 'fry onions until caramelised - about 5-10 minutes'?". Her reply floored me - "ha! yeah, 10 minutes? They'd be burned by then!". I spent the next few minutes trying to expla…

She's thinking of browning. Most people simply don't know what caramelization is.

I’m not sure five minutes is even enough for browning

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#528

Post by _fat_santa » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:10 PM UTC

hk1337 wrote: post #517

isaacfrond wrote: post #131

My sister in law writes recipes. She has a recipe column in a newspaper and wrote a few high quality recipe books. I saw them in a bookstore. So she's reasonable successful. Her pieces are charming, her recipes inspiring. The thing is. At a birthday party when I was talking to her, she confessed to me that she never actually tries her recipes. When it's time to do a new piece, she sits down at her computer and makes…

I am convinced they add red and yellow bell peppers strictly because they think the dish needs more color. I _hate_ bell peppers. I can tolerate them in big chunks where I can pick them out but if you dice them up and mix it in, I won't eat it.

For what it's worth, I found the best way to make them is to cut them into very thin slices. My rule is bell peppers have to always be "bite sized" because of how tough they are. If you make the pieces to big, you will have to "bite into" the pepper rather than eating it whole and I think that's where they get a bad rap since they can be very tough to bite into.

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#529

Post by downut » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:11 PM UTC

sanitycheck wrote: post #421

I've had this conversation with people many times, a consequence is that some of them have no idea what caramelised onions actually are - they think it's the state you get to after 10 mins. Thinly slice 10 onions, dump them in a big pot with some oil on a medium heat for 10-15 minutes stirring frequently. Then turn the heat down to low and cook for a further 45-60 mins, check on it and stir every 10 mins or so. When…

Yeah that works on my Viking stove with my competent pans, and is basically how I do it, but people with shitty stoves, i.e. the majority, have burners with hot spots and/or mismatched pan widths or even too thin pan bottoms. I suspect that's where the constant stirring/too short time business might originate.

I never realized how widespread this was until I brought dishes to group meals (as in Slow Food) and people complimented me for my caramelized onions.

Re: Why do recipe writers lie about how long it takes to caramelize onions? (2012)

#530

Post by escapedmoose » Tue, May 23, 2023, 1:11 PM UTC

henrikschroder wrote: post #192

isaacfrond wrote: post #131

My sister in law writes recipes. She has a recipe column in a newspaper and wrote a few high quality recipe books. I saw them in a bookstore. So she's reasonable successful. Her pieces are charming, her recipes inspiring. The thing is. At a birthday party when I was talking to her, she confessed to me that she never actually tries her recipes. When it's time to do a new piece, she sits down at her computer and makes…

As if I needed more fuel on the fire of my burning hatred for recipe collections. Everyone who is interested in cooking should do themselves a favour and buy a proper cookbook. Something that starts with the basics, and works itself up to full meals. It should have cheat-sheets for basic ways to cook all your staples, here's all the ways you can cook a potato, with times and temperature. Here's all the ways you can s…

This is why I use The Joy of Cooking and virtually no other recipe source. It’s a giant book because in each section it describes the mechanics behind whatever the section is based on; e.g. the poultry chapter starts with 10 or so pages describing how to select a chicken depending on how it’ll be cooked, how to cut it apart, what different poultry terminology means, etc. It teaches you what it means to “braise” or “broil” or “sauté,” etc.

For someone who didn’t learn to cook growing up, that book is a godsend.

On the other hand, I refuse to make recipes found on the internet. They work extremely rarely if you’re like me and don’t have a sense of “what the authors really mean when they say X.”