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Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

seattletimes.com

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Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#41

Post by charcircuit »

chadcmulligan wrote: post #35
btbuildem wrote: post #18

Wow, the pro-corp tone in some of the comments is surprising. Software jobs are one of the few remaining ones where we still hold the means of production -- and can withhold them to our leverage. These folks are walking out for the right reasons -- big f-off to RTO, and even if a bit late, the layoffs.

There are so many people that stand to lose if a fully remote work force came to pass. Building management, HR, middle managers, property investors, they're the ones you're hearing I'd guess. Pure software dev jobs are very easy to do remotely, it's not like we spend all day talking to people any way.

Software developers lose due to increased competition. Instead of competing with just silicon valley you are competing with the entire world.

Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#42

Post by toomuchtodo »

monero-xmr wrote: post #36
btbuildem wrote: post #18

Wow, the pro-corp tone in some of the comments is surprising. Software jobs are one of the few remaining ones where we still hold the means of production -- and can withhold them to our leverage. These folks are walking out for the right reasons -- big f-off to RTO, and even if a bit late, the layoffs.

[flagged]

Or you unionize. It’s federally protected activity. Only takes 30% to petition the NLRB to hold a vote. I know, the horror of suggesting such an idea on a hyper capitalism forum. Most people aren’t business owners or shareholders, they are workers. The startup lottery is a lottery: you likely will see nothing as an employee. You might not even see market rate as an employee at an established business. And there is ample evidence a unionized business can still be successful.

Workers deserve agency (I suppose this is the point we’re negotiating), and they have the means to acquire it and then defend it. Whether they do so is up to the suffering they’re willing to tolerate collectively.

https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/what-we-do/conduct-elections

Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#43

Post by dumpsterdiver »

btbuildem wrote: post #18

Wow, the pro-corp tone in some of the comments is surprising. Software jobs are one of the few remaining ones where we still hold the means of production -- and can withhold them to our leverage. These folks are walking out for the right reasons -- big f-off to RTO, and even if a bit late, the layoffs.

> Software jobs are one of the few remaining ones where we still hold the means of production

Typical software jobs absolutely do not "hold the means of production".

The aforementioned "means of production" likely includes years of work from an entire sales team in order to land paying customers in the first place. What good are the "means of production" when no one is buying your product?

Cool, you built a useful piece of software... are you ready to pay a cool million to your sales people to actually get it out the door? No? Well then you don't own the means of production. You own a pipe dream.

How about paying for all of those cloud servers that your customers run on? When you write code does it also automatically pay your cloud server bills? Guess what, those servers are required to actually run the god-granted code that you put on this earth.

Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#45

Post by clipsy »

hirako2000 wrote: post #25
olliej wrote: post #9

If only there were some kind of organization employees could belong to that would help counter the asymmetric power of corporations.

The interesting part it isn't even needed for this walk to organise. We don't need unions like we used to, some online admin at most is enough

That sounds lovely, but I think you're getting a bit ahead of yourself. They haven't actually won any concessions or really accomplished anything yet; they haven't even demonstrated a reasonably successful walkout yet (we'll see whether they can manage that on the day of). For what it's worth, though, I hope your optimism is justified.

Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#47

Post by sleepybrett »

idlewords wrote: post #13

The danger of any walkout is that you won't be allowed to walk back in. The time for useful collective action was back when tech companies couldn't hire fast enough, and tech employees enjoyed unusual leverage. After 27,000 layoffs, a performative walkout without a defined goal is just making it easier for Amazon management as they plan the next round of cuts.

If the number is a large enough percentage they couldn't do a lockout. While it may be an industry-wide supply side problem for employees you can't just fire a huge portion of the staff and hire new people and expect things to just keep on truckin', losing that much institutional knowledge would be suicide.

Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#48

Post by coin »

Uehreka wrote: post #31
coin wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting FAANG salary isn’t enough?

Can people on this site please stop acting like everyone in tech (or “everyone in tech who matters”) is working for FAANG and getting a FAANG salary? Believe it or not there exist software developers who make less than $100k.

Correct, not everyone is fortunate to get FAANG-type compensation. But the article in question is about Amazon workers (one of the As in FAANG).

Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#49

Post by WheelsAtLarge »

I'm always surprised to see this much desire to work from home all the time. The way I see it. Given a few years, every work from home job will be outsource to some country where the pay is less. Companies are all about cutting costs. If a job can be done at home then it can be done from anywhere in the world. Why not hire the least expensive workforce?

Re: Seattle Amazon workers plan walkout over return to office, layoffs

#50

Post by beoberha »

Madmallard wrote: post #21
coin wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting FAANG salary isn’t enough?

With return to office it's nowhere near enough on the west coast. Unless you hold a top position at a large corporation on the west coast you don't even have enough money to buy a house. Considering you're helping generate billions in revenue yeah, I'd say you should be being paid more.

This isn’t true at all and paints a dangerously dystopian view of things. You could easily buy a home in Seattle or the neighboring area after 5 years of senior level employment at most publicly traded companies. It’s not going to be an amazing home and there certainly will be some sticker shock when comparing that price tag to most other cities, but it’s totally feasible. The idea that you need to have a “top position” is ludicrous
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