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Writing Python like it's Rust
81–90 of 369 posts
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#82> Dataclasses instead of tuples or dictionaries The point is good in general, but it's still perfectly possible to use tuples and get all the field name and typing benefits: just use typed named tuples [1]. Unfortunately this is buried in the typing module. I couldn't even find it in the table if contents, and I knew what I was specifically looking for. https://docs.python.org/3/library/typing.html#typing.NamedTu...
Named tuples, typed or not, are a bad idea for most data structures. They might make some sense when dealing with coordinates (x, y, z), but why would you want to use it for an Employee class, as shown in the example? This is a tuple, so you can iterate over it, employee[0] == "Guido", and employee[1] == 3. This isn’t useful in any way, it’s confusing, and it’s making it harder to change the order of fields in this c…
I dipped my toe into NamedTuple. Where it falls down is that it requires a custom serialiser. Python's json library is a crock of shit once you've used .net.
TypedDict turned out to be the winner. The runtime type is dict but you get all the benefits of type annotations. I dropped it into a crappy codebase without touching the calling methods.
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
I also do not consider websites or smartphone apps to be serious software, despite the huge amount of work that happens to be done there. You know the rule, 99% of everything is crud.
I find it hard to understand how you can believe something like Dropbox isn't "serious production" just because it involves websites and apps.
the program that does the synchronization of files in the background is.
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#84Earlier quoted context omitted.
Typically, the selection of a programming language is predetermined in brownfield projects, leaving little room for choosing the "ideal" programming language for migration unless it is absolutely necessary (go can be a suitable option for migrations). Code, like the one provided by the OP, should be valued and encouraged to prevent future bugs. Incorporating tools like Mypy during pre-commit and pyright during code e…
I'm pretty sure any serious company uses C++ for the code that matters, and Python for orchestration (assuming no high scalability requirements), GUI, offline data analysis and calibration, etc.
Your idea of "serious company" is outdated by at least 20 years.
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#85[deleted]
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#86This is a great way to to write very unaesthetic Python.
It's almost like with Python you have a spectrum of aesthetics and maintainability. The "most aesthetic" (concise and readable-as-plain-English) code involves a lot of magic (metaclasses, dynamic dispatch etc.), so it's better left to foundational libraries with extensive testing by thousands of developers.
Except they probably have a ton of asserts and type hints under the hood, so only the interface is "aesthetic". And if you just want to write a maintainable code, it's less work to just stick to simpler and uglier constructs with explicit types.
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#87See how much discipline is needed to "write Python as Rust"? This is the real problem: you can have great code in dynamic/liberal/forgiving languages, but it will be due to programmer's discipline. Using a tool like Rust (or other strict/strongly-typed languages) forces some quality constraints on all code that compiles. This is, to me, a great benefit of these languages.
You need even more discipline to write code without the type hints. So a move in the right direction.
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#88I went through a similar journey, without the Rust part. Started using type hints, data classes, pydantic to get the benefit of static typing after dealing with the pain of refactoring dynamically typed projects. It was better, but it _feels_ like lipstick on a pig. I love Python, but types are not what it's best at. It's missing features that makes typing easier. I've realized if was going to write typed Python, I m…
What can .NET do that Python+mypy cannot?
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#89Lots of comments here are stating that typing is half baked in Python, and that if you gotta use types, you should use another language. But that's missing the point that Python is still not meant to be the best at anything, but good at most things. And in this case, it's exactly what you get: optional typing, with decent safety if you need it. You can quick script or design seriously, you can explore in a shell or c…
> the fields I need tools for are vast, and it's the only one that I'm pretty sure will handle a problem decently in all it's various forms
Whilst I agree with this stance to some extent, we should be clear that Python is not in fact the panacea you've made it out to be here. It is very possible that a particular problem requires performance Python can't match, so that any Python solution will be too big/ slow/ clumsy and must be rewritten in a better language. It is also very possible that a particular problem requires safety Python can't match, so that any Python solution will be too dangerous and must be rewritten in an appropriate safe language to avoid unacceptable losses.
Re: Writing Python like it's Rust
#90Lots of comments here are stating that typing is half baked in Python, and that if you gotta use types, you should use another language. But that's missing the point that Python is still not meant to be the best at anything, but good at most things. And in this case, it's exactly what you get: optional typing, with decent safety if you need it. You can quick script or design seriously, you can explore in a shell or c…
Everything you just said is true for Typescript, as you can set it up as strict or as forgiving as you like, and writing one off scripts for node is just as easy as for Python. But unlike Python, it has a great type system.