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People who die by suicide want to stop suffering, not to stop living

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Re: People who die by suicide want to stop suffering, not to stop living

#21

Thought this was obvious

I think some people have never experienced prolonged periods of suffering, and thus it is hard for them to imagine .

We may have not experienced prolonged pain, but we all have experienced suffering. Life itself is synonymous with suffering, for all but those few master sages who have been successful in conquering all of their cravings and reaching the utmost of equanimity.

Suicide itself is virtually always a highly disordered act, that only demonstrates how deeply the person resorting to it is mired in her cravings. While some kinds of physical or spiritual pain might in fact be a real obstacle to attaining inner growth, this is quite rare and not what most people are dealing with.

Re: People who die by suicide want to stop suffering, not to stop living

#22
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> sometimes the window doesn’t seem so bad. No, the window still seems awful but it’s the choice you make. From David Foster Wallace: “The so-called ‘psychotically depressed’ person who tries to kill herself doesn’t do so out of quote ‘hopelessness’ or any abstract conviction that life’s assets and debits do not square. And surely not because death seems suddenly appealing. The person in whom Its invisible agony reac…

"looking up and yelling ‘Don’t!’ and ‘Hang on!" Are there people who actually yell this? It seems pretty obvious why they're jumping.

"Do a flip!" might make them laugh enough to reconsider.

Re: People who die by suicide want to stop suffering, not to stop living

#23
Related, is it difficult all over the US to find mental health resources? Wait times for counselors and therapists are months+. Additionally, insurance seems to not cover mental health stuff well if at all, if you're lucky to get an appointment it seems you're paying out of pocket.

Re: People who die by suicide want to stop suffering, not to stop living

#25
post #4

"...what is it we need but more life? What does the infant need but more life? What does the bosom of his mother give him but life in abundance? What does the old man need, whose limbs are weak and whose pulse is low, but more of the life which seems ebbing from him? Weary with feebleness, he calls upon death, but in reality it is life he wants. It is but the encroaching death in him that desires death. He longs for…

Another relevant quote by David foster wallace :

The so-called ‘psychotically depressed’ person who tries to kill herself doesn’t do so out of quote ‘hopelessness’ or any abstract conviction that life’s assets and debits do not square. And surely not because death seems suddenly appealing. The person in whom Its invisible agony reaches a certain unendurable level will kill herself the same way a trapped person will eventually jump from the window of a burning high-rise. Make no mistake about people who leap from burning windows. Their terror of falling from a great height is still just as great as it would be for you or me standing speculatively at the same window just checking out the view; i.e. the fear of falling remains a constant. The variable here is the other terror, the fire’s flames: when the flames get close enough, falling to death becomes the slightly less terrible of two terrors. It’s not desiring the fall; it’s terror of the flames. And yet nobody down on the sidewalk, looking up and yelling ‘Don’t!’ and ‘Hang on!’, can understand the jump. Not really. You’d have to have personally been trapped and felt flames to really understand a terror way beyond falling.

Re: People who die by suicide want to stop suffering, not to stop living

#27

This fits the saying very well: Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem.

For those suffering, it isn’t always clear that the problem is temporary.

The problems pile up until the person feels they are insurmountable, permanent. It consumes their entire existence.

In their eyes it’s a fair trade: permanent solution to a permanent problem.

The trick is convincing them the issue is temporary, which basically amounts to solving the underlying problems.

Re: People who die by suicide want to stop suffering, not to stop living

#30
This is something that I have had some personal experience with. I've known quite a few suicides, and survivors of the suicides of others.

Very much a "walk a mile in a man's shoes" kind of thing. Everyone has opinions on the matter, until it hits them. Then, they have personal experience (not just an opinion).

It sucks. In some cases, I can see why someone would want to end it all. In others, like this one[0], I find it doubly tragic, as there are proven alternative solutions (I personally know many people that were once far worse off than that gentleman, and are now doing quite well).

When we are in a singularity of pain, it seems like the suffering will never stop, and we can convince ourselves there's no escape. In some cases, we're right, but other times, not so much.

It's a permanent "solution" to what is often a temporary problem.

[0] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/man-holland-...

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