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Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

theatlantic.com

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Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#71

Post by mym1990 »

jameshart wrote: post #45
mym1990 wrote: post #5

A drug that promotes weight loss, lessens the desire to smoke, drink, etc...sounds too good to be true? From what I have heard, all of these issues come back as soon as someone comes off the drug. So either a person is committing to a lifetime of being dependent on this drug, or a person is committing to some period of time of ideal living, followed by a possible time of depression after reverting to the status quo.

> A drug that promotes weight loss, lessens the desire to smoke, drink, etc...sounds too good to be true? What other desires does it lessen? Does it suppress every hedonistic impulse? What does it do to creativity? Impulsivity? Does it make you more susceptible to or resistant to persuasion? Feels like reporting ‘oh it has these other unintended psychological/behavioral responses. Neat!’ is ignoring a whole can of wo…

I think the body of work around what this drug does outside of its impact on patients with diabetes is pretty limited, which is what is scary about everyone jumping on this one.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#72

Post by iwanttocomment »

mym1990 wrote: post #68
iwanttocomment wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why "it stops working when you stop taking it" is used as an argument against these new peptides. This is the way almost every medication we encounter works. Tylenol might get rid of your headache, but that headache can come back tomorrow. Stop taking birth control and you might get pregnant. Stop taking Claritin and your allergies return. Stop taking insulin, and, as with these new peptides, you lose co…

I am not holding Ozempic to needing to be the cure for anything. My point is that people without diabetes are looking to this drug for weight loss, at which point they create a dangerous dependency, with no hard evidence that their actual health improves. This is opposed to coming up with long term solutions that involve re-evaluating daily decisions that lead to some of these diseases in the first place. If Ozempic…

Is it really a dangerous dependency? There's been no evidence of anything happening once individuals go off of semaglutide or tirzepatide other than the tendency of gaining weight to the original levels and/or blood sugar readings returning to the pre-medication levels. This is the most common outcome anyone has trying literally any calorie-reducing diet, medication or not. There's no evidence that people are ending up worse for having been on the medication, except for some who experience gastro effects early on and can simply quit.

Also, yes, you can absolutely advocate for a low-carb/low-sugar diet for those with poor blood sugar control. The issue there is that virtually every medical professional has advocated for similar diets for diabetics or those with blood sugar control issues for centuries, or even millennia - there is evidence of recommended diets for those with diabetes since BCE. This does not mean that those diets are easy or pleasant to follow, whereas all evidence indicates that common issues with appetite and energy on a limited calorie or low-carb diet are less prevalent with these new peptides than those trying to go it alone.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#73

Post by iwanttocomment »

kristofferR wrote: post #39
rektide wrote: post #9

I'm surprised Ozempic gets all the press. Supposedly Mounjaro is all that and more. The wonderful Paul Ford has the best writeup I've seen that discusses these more meta levels, the post-human implications of a drug we can genuinely widescalely reprogram ourselves with. Paul's so great. https://www.wired.com/story/new-drug-switched-off-appetite-m... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34660232

Massive text: "People taking Mounjaro lost up to 25 LBS" Small text underneath: "Mounjaro is not a weight loss drug." Man, the US pharma industry/marketing is so weird. https://www.mounjaro.com/#:~:text=mounjaro%20is%20not%20a%20... .

Mounjaro is not yet approved for weight loss in the US even though there is strong evidence that it will be, and there's little question that there has generally been weight loss in those taking it for diabetes.

Recent studies have very clearly shown it's effective for weight loss even in those without diabetes, but there's a lag as the FDA reviews those studies. Until then, Lilly simply can't advertise it as a treatment for obesity.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#74

Post by iwanttocomment »

shagymoe wrote: post #66
amanaplanacanal wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, suggesting that people eat less and exercise more doesn’t seem to actually work that well. We’ve been trying that for decades and the obesity epidemic just keeps getting worse.

Have we though? I seriously doubt doctors are aggressively pushing eating well and exercising. Has anyone ever received a workout plan from their doctor besides some generic PT exercises? Do they develop nutrition plans tailored to you? Do they track your progress? Do they have any incentive for you to actually get better? Do they require regular blood tests and include all the tests that might actually tell them som…

I seriously doubt doctors are aggressively pushing eating well and exercising.

Have you ever... been to a doctor when you've been obese? I assure you that they will indeed push eating well and exercising to obese people. Even when you've already been eating well and exercising. This will not be an intervention by the PCP themselves - your primary can really just refer people to substantial interventions - but they will try to refer you to one of three things.

First, they will recommend a book on healthy eating and exercising.

Second, there is behavioral weight loss, which generally is a combination of an appetite-suppression medication like phentermine and a Very Low Calorie Diet through a pre-made controlled calorie diet (such as Medifast or Optifast). A program like this will absolutely require weigh-ins and blood tests.

Third, they will recommend surgical weight loss, most likely gastric bypass, such as Roux-en-Y. There are guaranteed to be medical follow-ups after the surgery.

If you are not clinically obese, and that's great, no, your PCP will not provide that type of advice. They're not there to help you with subclinical concerns with weight. There are plenty of dietitians out there who can.

Anyway, that's not a resounding no - it is extremely common to be referred to these programs if you have any substantial level of obesity. If you're obese, and you haven't been referred to these programs by your PCP, that might be an issue with your primary.

What's exciting about these new peptides is that a simple once-a-week injection might be able to be prescribed by a primary with limited intervention or without outside specialists or surgery and still have good results in terms of weight-loss, as opposed to the truly exhausting requirements of a medically-assisted VLCD or weight loss surgery.

Finally, I have no idea what you're talking about Vitamin D. I've both been diagnosed with a Vitamin D deficiency by my primary (through blood tests!), and Vitamin D supplements are easily available over the counter without a prescription.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#75

Post by iwanttocomment »

mym1990 wrote: post #65
karaterobot wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a lot of people, it's kind of a choice of which substance you are going to be dependent on. It's all expensive and sad, but between Ozempic and cigarettes, alcohol, or overeating, Ozempic has got to be healthier, and quite possibly cheaper in the long run.

Healthier in what sense? There is little knowledge of long term side effects and it isn't even approved for weight loss, it is specifically for people with diabetes.

Semaglutide, the active ingredient in Ozempic, is absolutely approved in the US for weight loss. Ozempic is the trade name for the diabetes medication, Wegovy is the trade name for the weight loss medication. They are the exact same medication, in the same formulation.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#76

Post by shrimp_emoji »

ikekkdcjkfke wrote: post #34
lumb63 wrote: post #23

I’m glad people are enjoying Ozempic. My experience from seeing a family member on it, is I would not touch it if I were a 500-pound alcoholic smoking two packs of cigarettes a day. That’s an exaggeration since it probably outweighs the health issues there, but only slightly. The person I know taking Ozempic has only lost weight (35 lbs) due to the fact that eating now makes her sick. She has been sapped of all energ…

Same experience here, gallstone attacks

You can get those from rapid weight loss, I thought. Maybe it's working TOO well if that's the case.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#77

Post by shrimp_emoji »

rektide wrote: post #9

I'm surprised Ozempic gets all the press. Supposedly Mounjaro is all that and more. The wonderful Paul Ford has the best writeup I've seen that discusses these more meta levels, the post-human implications of a drug we can genuinely widescalely reprogram ourselves with. Paul's so great. https://www.wired.com/story/new-drug-switched-off-appetite-m... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34660232

My favorite Linux distro; it's basically a user-friendly Arch with goodies like a GUI kernel switcher thrown in.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#78

Post by opportune »

glonq wrote: post #61

What happens when you reach your target weight with drugs like this? After having learned potentionally nothing about nutrition, exercise, and self-control, are you stuck on these meds for life out of fear of binge-eating back to your original weight? FWIW I'm on a hundred-pound roller coaster ride from 300lbs to 200lbs; currently ~215. I've learned a lot about discipline and sustainable habits along the way.

I’ve never been obese but after losing 30+ lbs of weight I found it a lot easier to live an active lifestyle and keep the weight off. Partly it was just that moving around was physically easier and less strenuous, but also that I was less self conscious and had higher self esteem.

I imagine Ozempic will help with this even if people don’t learn about nutrition per se. Though I think basically everybody knows nutrition, it’s more about self control IME.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#79

Post by opportune »

rektide wrote: post #16
BizarroLand wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can buy it as a "research chemical" and save money, but then the potential consequences of diy medicine and all that that entails are all on you. Hopefully the price will come down more as it becomes more prevalent or as generics become available.

I'm not that afraid of swallowing random chemicals but self injecting is a bit hardcore for me.

Steroid users do it all the time and I haven’t heard of steroid users dealing with infections much.

Re: Ozempic drug supresses desire to smoke, drink and more?

#80

Post by spondylosaurus »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #67
spondylosaurus wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am really concerned this is going to lead to a bigger health crises than the one it purported to solve. A lot of diabetics taking it to regulate blood sugar (particular the feedback loop with insulin and hunger) have said it's changed their life... but for people who are merely overweight I think the benefits may not always be worth the side effects. IMO the correlation between weight and health is not as strong…

Obesity is the number one cause of heart disease, which is the number one killer in this country. No, its health effects are not being overstated.

Sure, but that doesn't mean everyone who's overweight has high blood pressure and therefore should go on "shit your brains out" medication.

EDIT: Also, to my previous anecdote, despite being the skinny one compared to my partner, I actually do have several heart problems! (Thank you inflammatory diseases.) But you wouldn't guess that by looking at me, because weight is not a 1:1 indicator of health.

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