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Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

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Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#171

Post by pessimizer »

darkteflon wrote: post #85
rtpg wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> PM2.5 levels in Tokyo yesterday were like 6x WHO limits and absolutely no one on the local news was talking about it What are you talking about? Localities sent a smog alert, made announcements on the speaker, and there was a whole thing. It was a particularly hot day as well. I don’t have that many reference points to be fair, but almost every time I’ve checked general air quality (at least according to the first…

It’s been like this for days, it will continue into next week. We had no announcements where I am, none of the news broadcasts I checked (and I checked a few) mentioned it. The Tokyo metro site wouldn’t even load on my phone. Glad you got a heads up. Don’t really care what Paris is like, tbh. Shit air is shit air. Saying it’s shitter somewhere else isn’t super compelling. The whole point of my original comment was th…

> Don’t really care what Paris is like, tbh. Shit air is shit air. Saying it’s shitter somewhere else isn’t super compelling.

Shitty is always relative, especially if you're comparing policy decisions.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#173

Post by throw0101c »

bena wrote: post #154
Gwypaas wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I ever go to mall? It is an awful experience. At most, when it would be too cumbersome to bring on public transport, I rent a car.

Not a "shopping mall" mall, but an old-school open area with shops and restaurants. I don't know if you watch Ted Lasso, but Lasso and Beard live right next to a mall and frequently walk through it or meet up at a bench there.

> […] but an old-school open area with shops and restaurants.

Which was the original idea for them:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shopping_mall#Downtown_pedestr...

But then car-centric urban design happened.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#174

Post by pessimizer »

darkteflon wrote: post #73
noduerme wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and wonder what the cost of all of this will be Likely the same extended lifespan that's been prevalent in Japan over the past century of smoking, diesel and construction (along with the occasional nuclear catastrophe). Humans are apparently more ruggedized than they look on paper.

And luckily, the only relevant measure of quality of life is the number of years lived, isn’t it.

Sarcasm isn't a cost.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#175

Post by mcv »

robertlagrant wrote: post #69
david-gpu wrote: post #17

I live in a high-rise condo next to a six-lane stroad that was even showcased on this YouTube channel and the 24/7 traffic noise is annoying, particularly when you want to go for a walk and can't even hold a conversation. This didn't happen in the places where I lived back in Europe because zoning laws were different. Instead of the sprawl of freehold single family homes separate from a dense urban core, these much q…

> This means people can live within walking distance to where they work and where they shop This is less common than you think. There are 8500 or so malls in Europe[0]. I happen to live near an (expensive) shop, which I use because I like walking places, but I also know I have a tech salary that lets me buy a place that's in walking distance of a shop, and afford to shop in it regularly. Also, plenty of people don't…

It really depends on where you live of course. If you live on a farm, you can't expect to have a supermarket next door.

However, the number of shopping malls is irrelevant; most shops are not in malls. In cities, there's generally shopping streets that have a wide variety of all sorts of shops. In suburban areas, there's often a small shopping center with one or two supermarkets, a Chinese restaurant, a snackbar, and a couple of other shops. Big American-style malls are rare here.

And supermarkets are very common. Just Netherland alone has over 6000 of them, and at least 6 of those are within 1.5 km from my home. There's a shopping center 500 m from my house, and a major shopping steet 1 km in the other direction. Stuff is dense, exactly because it doesn't focus on massive malls.

And for anything they don't have in my neighbourhood, I take my bike.

Of course this is a city; in small villages you'll probably still need a car for anything beyond bread and basic groceries.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#176

Post by throwaway10563 »

npteljes wrote: post #118
s_dev wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's so weird that the 'noise' of petrol cars is considered a safety feature. I've heard from the older generation "Yeah but EVs don't make noise which makes them extremely dangerous. Could easily kill a child or old woman who steps out on to a road because they don't hear a car coming". It must be the same group of people with their anecdotes about seatbelts and airbags making cars more dangerous.

Yeah. The issue in itself has little merit, because cyclists are also very quiet, even quieter than an EV, and would also send a pedestrian flying on collision.

The issue is negligible with bicycles since they can generally avoid distracted pedestrians unlike cars, and even then they are equipped with bells for that specific purpose.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#177

Post by nicoburns »

Reason077 wrote: post #167
bombolo wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> diesel buses Ah, we love the electric ones here in sweden! Of course they have to stop ~20 minutes to recharge instead of just turning back. And of course when it's cold (which surprisingly does happen in sweden) the batteries can't hold enough charge to do 1 run, so they can't run.

> "Of course they have to stop ~20 minutes to recharge instead of just turning back." London's electric buses (mostly UK-built bus bodies with BYD drivetrains and batteries) have large enough battery packs for them to run all day without charging. They get recharged overnight, when electricity is cheap, while parked in the bus depots. As of March, London had 785 fully electric buses in service, out of a total fleet o…

London's hybrid buses are also pretty good for noise (not as good as electric, but a lot better than direct diesel propulsion). No loud bursts of noise when accelerating.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#178

Post by tikhonj »

michaelteter wrote: post #84

There are two issues here. One is that we need to come up with comprehensive solutions for reducing the number of vehicles in use. But that’s a difficult problem where solutions take decades and must be tailored to each scenario. But what can be addressed now is the engine and exhaust sound levels. Some vehicles are loud because their engines are working hard, but many vehicles are loud because people (boys) want the…

My experience living in a relatively quiet area has been that the loudest vehicles, by far, are garbage trucks followed by other kinds of trucks. But it is much harder to do something about that because they serve an economic purpose and it would presumably be very expensive to make them quieter. It's a lot easier to blame people with gratuitously loud cars and motorcycles because they don't have a real excuse, even if they have less of an impact in absolute terms.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#179

Post by Mawr »

chrisldgk wrote: post #115
michaelteter wrote: post #84

There are two issues here. One is that we need to come up with comprehensive solutions for reducing the number of vehicles in use. But that’s a difficult problem where solutions take decades and must be tailored to each scenario. But what can be addressed now is the engine and exhaust sound levels. Some vehicles are loud because their engines are working hard, but many vehicles are loud because people (boys) want the…

I think you’re focusing on the wrong issue here. Engine noise nowadays is a lot less of a problem than tire noise, especially with cars going 50km/h+. Some cars are loud because people want them to be, most cars are loud because the noise the tires make when driving is loud, and that only gets worse the more cars you have around.

There's a key relationship you're missing here. The closer a car is to humans, the slower it will drive. The slower it drives, the more important engine noise is.

A car going 50km/h+ is on some sort of a highway, where noise and pollution are less relevant. It's the cars going Empirically, engine noise dominates then. The difference between ICEs and EVs passing by is staggeringly obvious.

Re: Cities Aren't Loud: Cars Are Loud (2021) [video]

#180

Post by aerojoe23 »

jenadine wrote: post #18

I live near an intersection, and the most annoying noise is honking. Why do driver have to honk so much is beyond me. Also quite annoying is ambulance/police. They are really loud.

Fire/ambulance/police are supposed to be exceptionally loud so they can get drivers attention and then they can get through. (I expect you know this already, but I'm making sure we're all on the same page.)

Over time cabins in vehicles have gotten more isolated with better sound systems. Outside has gotten generally louder. Both of these things mean the emergency sirens need to be even louder for it to get a drivers attention.

I'm not sure if it is because drivers don't hear/see them or if they just don't care anymore, but almost every time I see a firetruck with it's lights and sirens on lately, I see it have to come to a stop and wait, get on the even louder horn, before drivers start getting out of its way. This isn't down the whole length of the street or anything, just once or twice before it drives out of my view (several blocks). I don't think I ever saw in person this before 10 years ago.

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