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Apple’s new headset meets reality

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Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#421

Post by seanmcdirmid »

neural_thing wrote: post #314
sli wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm willing to spend a lot on VR, but Apple would have to absolutely blow everything else out of the water at that price point. I have no doubt that a lot of Apple enthusiasts will buy them, but they've certainly chosen a specific market. You could buy a full Index kit, get the wireless upgrade for it, and then a full Vive Pro kit and its wireless upgrade, and have spent about the same amount of money.

I'm willing to spend $3,000 on a device that I would want to use every day. The reason I don't spend that much on existing VR tech is that I don't want to use it.

I use my quest every day and if there is a better experience to be had for $3k, I would pay it. I was put off by the quest pro, it wasn’t really better (for my use case) and $1k?

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#422

Post by meowtimemania »

dmarcos wrote: post #254
givemeethekeys wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple products: - PCs were already growing in popularity. - Mp3 players were already growing in popularity. - Smart phones were already growing in popularity. - Bluetooth headphones were already growing in popularity. - Home automation was already growing in popularity. Apple usually takes a look at a growing trend and decides that it can provide a far better experience. ... with the exception of: Apple Watch. - Appl…

Yeah. Apple enters when there’s clear product-market and out-executes everybody. For the watch, notice that fitness trackers (Fitbit) were already getting popular.

is there not a clear VR product market? I know lots of people that own oculus headsets

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#423

Post by 8n4vidtmkvmk »

intrasight wrote: post #337
trefoiled wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s interesting to dismiss this criticism as “impossibly high standards” when VR as a market is clearly a disaster. The person you replied to is of the same opinion as the vast majority of consumers, who have either not purchased a headset or did, but now leave it in a closet gathering dust. VR clearly will not be viable on a massive scale until it takes a major leap forward.

When those major leaps occur, Apple should be well-positioned. Remember they play the long game. My office mate had Apple's first tablet 30 years ago - the Newton. And even further back - 40 years ago - Jobs said he didn't want the Mac to have a keyboard and mouse. He rightfully considered those to be a very artificial means of human-machine interface. His engineers made him understand that current tech didn't yet fu…

What dream was eventually realized? We still use kb and mouse

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#424

Post by drdaeman »

honestgamer4 wrote: post #408
drdaeman wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that I'm pretty sure it won't work with anything but Apple ecosystem. No chance in hell it would work with existing SteamVR libraries or Oculus Stores. And Apple's domain is currently entirely empty of any VR/AR/XR applications. While I expect Safari to get OpenXR^W WebXR support (IIRC it's still not there, right?), even if the hardware specs will be suporior, it is hard to call it an advancement (something th…

I think you mean WebXR in regards to Safari, not OpenXR.

Yes, thank you. I’ve edited my comment.

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#425

Post by nologic01 »

A less discussed headwind I see with the AR/VR adoption is the isolated and niche role of 3D more generally.

Its major in games, its important in some technical applications but the 3D metaphor is hard to make as interaction friendly as 2D.

All the hardware, physiological and cultural challenges with headsets come on top of this very peculiar starting point that somehow does not have the versatility of the flat screen UI

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#426

Post by chaostheory »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #421
neural_thing wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm willing to spend $3,000 on a device that I would want to use every day. The reason I don't spend that much on existing VR tech is that I don't want to use it.

I use my quest every day and if there is a better experience to be had for $3k, I would pay it. I was put off by the quest pro, it wasn’t really better (for my use case) and $1k?

In some ways, the quest pro is better. The headset is thinner and lighter. It’s much easier to mod for comfort. It has more RAM and a faster chip. Hand tracking is noticeably better. I didn’t think I would enjoy an open headset, but I like it much better than the enclosed quest 2, but that’s personal preference since I primarily use it to workout and I like having awareness of my surroundings like when I play normal flat games. I believe it’s new PCVR features like foveated rendering and desktop mirroring are also advantages over the quest 2

Surprisingly, what’s worse are the pro controllers. If you have hand tracking turned on, you will constantly lose controller tracking. Even if you turn off hand tracking, you will still lose some controller tracking in fast paced games like beat saber. I am constantly also losing haptic feedback. The original controllers are superior for gaming.

You can pick up the pro from scalpers on eBay for -$800 if you don’t want to pay $1000 for retail. at $800, it feels more like a fair price.

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#427

Post by cafed00d »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #236
bredren wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is hard to not compare the breakthrough product release count between Jobs and Cook. If that is the measure, then we have to bring in Jobs' tenure as not only CEO but company founder that stretched 25 years as CEO, 1976 to 1985 and 1997 to 2011. Cook only took the reins in 2011, and at that time arguably the company should not have focused on releasing yet more revolutionary products. iPhone is the most successful…

> One product often left out, which may have started with Jobs, but delivery should be attributed to Cook is the new Apple HQ. The initial impact has crumbled due to Covid WFH. > However, this campus may turn out to be a force multiplier going forward. If so, it is a victory, but not in the minds of consumers. Curious, have you ever actually talked to anyone that worked there? While I have admittedly only talked to a…

I work at Apple Park and it’s awesome. I love it! Been here 4ish years.

On my current team we share a hall-wide office that seats 4. On my old team I shared a half-hall wide room with another person.

Most people have this 2 person arrangement. Some teams sit in groups of 6-8 together. All of this is Siri.

Teams in other orgs are wildly different. I had a friend in iCloud that was in one of those open office style arrangements. She hated it. She left to Netflix eventually.

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#428

Post by Sai_ »

peyton wrote: post #412
JKCalhoun wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only worked there briefly (I never officially had an office there — Covid times and all that). I don't see it as any different than any of the other Apple campus buildings I worked in (like Infinite Loop) with regard to productivity. (I've always compared it to some beautiful, modern art gallery — but without any art.) But to the above degree, I have to say I enjoyed all large Apple work environments (even some of…

Yeah Apple’s DRI system means it’s pretty easy to just talk to the guy . No PM nonsense. It’s nice.

DRI - directly responsible individual, for those who didn’t know.

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#429

Post by raverbashing »

peyton wrote: post #412
JKCalhoun wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only worked there briefly (I never officially had an office there — Covid times and all that). I don't see it as any different than any of the other Apple campus buildings I worked in (like Infinite Loop) with regard to productivity. (I've always compared it to some beautiful, modern art gallery — but without any art.) But to the above degree, I have to say I enjoyed all large Apple work environments (even some of…

Yeah Apple’s DRI system means it’s pretty easy to just talk to the guy . No PM nonsense. It’s nice.

No PM nonsense but there's some NDA nonsense even between internal teams no?

Re: Apple’s new headset meets reality

#430

Post by erichocean »

sbuk wrote: post #376
erichocean wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Jobs trusted Cook to find and keep people who could design products Tim Cook's first major executive move as CEO was to fire Scott Forstall.

Forstall’s first big unguided product delivery was Maps. He royally screwed the pooch with the release. By all accounts, he was fairly toxic in the executive group, he had to go.

> By all accounts, he was fairly toxic in the executive group, he had to go.

So was Steve Jobs—Tim Cook would have fired him, too, if he could.

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