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Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

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Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#11
post #4

The title and article aren't quite telling you the truth. The bill allows providers to decline to provide specific services where those services are in opposition to their beliefs. It does not allow them to deny all health care, just those specific services they are opposed to. It's a subtle difference, but an important one.

So like, if I believe that it's immoral to touch a gay person, and I am an EMT who encounters a bleeding gay person?

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#12
post #2

So does this mean you can deny medical care to those who support this bill? [That feels like that would be in the spirit of this bill]

I suppose if:

1. your sincere religious beliefs impelled you to deny all medical care to people based on their beliefs - in other words your religion establishes that certain beliefs make you an unperson.

AND

2. This bill were written saying anything at all about denying all medical care, which it is not, since the provider would be forced to identify specific forms of care that they were unwilling to provide to _all_ people, rather than _all_ forms of care to _certain_ people.

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#13
post #10
post #4

The title and article aren't quite telling you the truth. The bill allows providers to decline to provide specific services where those services are in opposition to their beliefs. It does not allow them to deny all health care, just those specific services they are opposed to. It's a subtle difference, but an important one.

My beliefs are that felons are unredeemable and undeserving of any care provision whatsoever. Hence, "just those specific services" becomes all health care. One should always imagine the worst case when writing good laws. Unfortunately, we all know this law is not meant to be good, it's meant to be a wedge.

This analysis of "what's the worst that could happen" is insufficient as the appropriate test is "what's the worst that could happen and how often could it happen"

Things that can go very wrong, but which in practice we may expect to be extremely rare are not necessarily large problems.

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#14
post #5

[flagged]

Compelled service with compensation still exists: Jury duty, contractual relationships (e.g. military stop-loss policies).

What this does is eliminate a particular contractual compulsion.

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#15
post #6

So, if I was a Dr., and a supporter of this law came under my care for a serious condition, could I throw him out of my office because of my religious beliefs

This bill allows providers to exclude forms of medical care across all patients, not persons of specific types.

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#16
post #10
post #4

The title and article aren't quite telling you the truth. The bill allows providers to decline to provide specific services where those services are in opposition to their beliefs. It does not allow them to deny all health care, just those specific services they are opposed to. It's a subtle difference, but an important one.

My beliefs are that felons are unredeemable and undeserving of any care provision whatsoever. Hence, "just those specific services" becomes all health care. One should always imagine the worst case when writing good laws. Unfortunately, we all know this law is not meant to be good, it's meant to be a wedge.

this bill does not allow exclusion of medical care based on your beliefs about the patient, but based on your beliefs about the medical care in question.

[It is deeply weird how uncurious the comments on this particular article are.]

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#17
Certainly it's debatable if doctors should be able to deny treatments they think aren't harmful but they see as religiously offensive. But the root disagreement here is primarily about harm, and we already have agreed as a society that doctors have a duty to not knowingly harm their patients. If you can frame something as a civil rights issue, that can help resolve some conflicts but doesn't do much in terms of resolving contentions around if a specific procedure is harmful to a patient or not. In medicine, it does simply boil down to either persuading physicans that the procedure isn't harmful, or determining as a society we will no longer accredit people as physicians if they believe it is harmful.

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#18
post #2

So does this mean you can deny medical care to those who support this bill? [That feels like that would be in the spirit of this bill]

I suppose if: 1. your sincere religious beliefs impelled you to deny all medical care to people based on their beliefs - in other words your religion establishes that certain beliefs make you an unperson. AND 2. This bill were written saying anything at all about denying all medical care, which it is not, since the provider would be forced to identify specific forms of care that they were unwilling to provide to _all…

> in other words your religion establishes that certain beliefs make you an unperson.

Not an unperson, but equivalent to supporting the enemy. Would you be comfortable saving the life of a person you know is a mass murderer, who hasn't yet been arrested of charged, and thus would be free to murder again after you save their life, for instance?

Re: Florida health care can now be denied based on moral, ethical, religious beliefs

#19
post #5

[flagged]

I think that medical professionals should be paid to administer treatment to human beings, regardless of the situation.

It is a human. They should be all treated the same unless the patient requests.

To do anything else is immoral rot.

What next, denial of treatment to someone you don't like? Or someone who committed a crime?

Sorry, I don't treat shoplifters, your cancer is God telling you that you did wrong

America has gone loony.

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