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The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#511

Post by jerf »

SkeuomorphicBee wrote: post #443
epolanski wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Switch combines lower powered A57 (a soc from..2012 on a 20nm process) with a Maxwell GPU (9+ years old at this point) Honestly this is the time to start working on a Switch successor, they could easily more than double the current compute capabilities while keeping the same or lower power envelope. That doesn't even counts the untapped bonuses from much higher memory speeds. I would instantly buy this, we would…

There is a big problem with any switch upgrade plan: Current GPU architectures are too different to the original Maxwell GPU arch, so it is impossible for Nintendo to make a better console that is hardware compatible to the switch. The games themselves include low level GPU driver stuff, so they won't run in any other GPU architecture without an emulation layer. In the past, Nintendo either forgone backwards compatib…

If you crawl back up to the top level of this thread, it's someone pointing out that emulating it on PC is a lot nicer. Nintendo only needs enough emulation to match the Switch 1's performance on their new hardware; anything they get over its original performance is gravy. Plus they have the option of zipping into the games they really care about and putting in special cases for the most performance-intensive stuff.

The Steam Deck, AIUI, more or less at least matches the Switch 1 in emulation. Haven't done anything with it myself.

I don't think emulation is even remotely impossible, and every year it gets easier for them.

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#512

Post by yamtaddle »

codq wrote: post #427
keenmaster wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know man. Compare the ambience of Zora’s Domain, music and all, to the equivalent area in BOTW. Compare the divine beasts to literally any temple in OOT. BOTW doesn’t even come close to the magic of Ocarina imo. The story in OOT was also much better imo. Seeing Hyrule as a kid and beginning to love it, then seeing it waste away as Adult Link, and being motivated to defeat an enemy with clear character develop…

Again, ‘as a kid’ is what’s going on here. I also grew up with OoT, absolutely obsessed and life-defining in many ways. Now I’m a certified Old, and while BotW didn’t click for me initially, I grew to love it and soon understood it to be one of the greatest games I’ve ever played. That did require me to consider the context though, and force myself to play it with a type of ‘beginner’s mind’. A few months ago, I deci…

> Same thing happened with Goldeneye. I can’t believe this was tolerable way back when. Nostalgia is a hell of a drug.

I played dozens of hours of Goldeneye back in the day (a friend had it, and I spent a lot of time at his house) but it very nearly wasn't tolerable to PC gamers. Its sole redeeming feature was that it was far more social than PC shooters. Playing it felt like going backwards 5-10 years in graphics, level design, gameplay, et c., plus the controls were astonishingly terrible (unless played in dual-controller mode, but that was no good for multiplayer). About the only feature it had going on that was up-to-date for the time were the multiple hit-zones on enemies (different animations and amount of damage depending on where you hit them).

Perfect Dark was a huge improvement in every way (and in many ways is still unsurpassed), and with modern controls on the XBox 360 port, I still play it to this day. Going back to Goldeneye from Perfect Dark, though? Oof. Even at the time, Perfect Dark's release seemed like it straight-up obsoleted Goldeneye, aided by the fact that it included renamed clones of some of the best Goldeneye multiplayer levels and many of the weapons (though, why would you play with them when you have Perfect Dark weapons available? They're so bland)

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#513

Post by jonwinstanley »

kimbernator wrote: post #462
jonwinstanley wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the last few generations Nintendo has been happy to be slightly behind Playstation and Xbox in terms of graphics so that they can be the lower-cost alternative. And based on unit sales, that strategy seems to be doing pretty well.

I think it's a really smart strategy. They avoided the raw-power hardware arms race and are thriving because of it. It seems like Nintendo picked up on what makes video games so fun early on while a lot of studios struggle with it even today: The gameplay comes first and it has to be fun. Art/style comes next, then way down the list is graphics. Graphics are the only thing about a video game that get worse with time.…

Totally agree. And Zelda is maybe the best example of this? The graphic style of the two recent games are distinctive and effective but are a long way from realistic by modern standards.

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#515

Post by yodsanklai »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #14

I was listening to a gaming podcast last week and they were talking about how this release was pirated and available for the last week or so on torrents. That in itself wasn't surprising, but the interesting point they talked about is that the game is much more enjoyable when played on PC with an emulated copy because modern gaming PC hardware is much smoother and higher resolution than the stock Switch. It really ma…

> the game is much more enjoyable when played on PC with an emulated copy

Neophyte question here, but what's the 3d engine used for this game? can you just change a parameter to make the game more realistic if the hardware supports it?

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#516

Post by saiya-jin »

SkeuomorphicBee wrote: post #443
epolanski wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Switch combines lower powered A57 (a soc from..2012 on a 20nm process) with a Maxwell GPU (9+ years old at this point) Honestly this is the time to start working on a Switch successor, they could easily more than double the current compute capabilities while keeping the same or lower power envelope. That doesn't even counts the untapped bonuses from much higher memory speeds. I would instantly buy this, we would…

There is a big problem with any switch upgrade plan: Current GPU architectures are too different to the original Maxwell GPU arch, so it is impossible for Nintendo to make a better console that is hardware compatible to the switch. The games themselves include low level GPU driver stuff, so they won't run in any other GPU architecture without an emulation layer. In the past, Nintendo either forgone backwards compatib…

I am sorry but I don't buy this. If switch can be 100% emulated on x86 hardware if given enough computing power (and in fact greatly improved with all that residual power unused), it can be run anywhere fast enough. Ie latest Snapdragon must be more than 10x faster in raw cpu power, not even going into graphics. And once you have your hands directly on hardware you can cut a lot of processing middlemen layers. Heck there could be some 'compatibility' chip just for this, literally nobody cares.

People obviously want this and would pay for this.

Its a really strange company, able to produce amazing software but horrible, terrible outdated hardware (ie joycon durability saga) that they stubbornly consider OK in 2023. Its not so much graphics details themselves, they have chosen graphic style well in this case, but ie overall responsiveness of device, FPS etc. We are talking about very well optimized phone thats 10 years old. More and more not so much up to current standards, ie low PFS puts too much strain on eyes.

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#517

Post by Jorengarenar »

vel0city wrote: post #487
X0Refraction wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always is a bit strong isn't it? Prior to the Wii their consoles tended to be similar to their contemporaries in processing power. I certainly experienced areas in BOTW which took a heavy FPS hit and it sounds like TOTK is similar. Such an FPS drop does take me out of the game so if the console was powerful enough to avoid that then you could argue it would allow more fun games

While their older consoles weren't as far away from modern stuff as the Switch, Nintendo wasn't often the more powerful console. Well-designed with good developer buy-in and incredibly strong first party titles, but not really pushing the envelope in terms of raw performance. The GameCube was the weakest hardware-wise between the PlayStation 2, Xbox, and ~~Dreamcast~~ edit: guess not the Dreamcast, but definitely beh…

> The GameCube was the weakest hardware-wise between the PlayStation 2, Xbox, and Dreamcast.

It might have been weak, but definitely was comparable (sometimes even stronger) in power to PS2 and definitely not weaker than Dreamcast [0].

> The Nintendo 64 was weaker than the PlayStation or Sega Saturn.

What? No, no, no. PlayStation was definitely weaker. N64 was crippled down by using cartridges instead of CD.

---

Despite the raw power, both N64 and GC were crushed by PS1 and PS2 in sales.

[0]: https://www.cs.umd.edu/~meesh/cmsc411/website/proj01/main/co...

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#518

Post by canyonero »

Tainnor wrote: post #357

I cannot describe in words how impactful Ocarina of Time was to me as a kid, how intensely I got sucked into that world to the point that I even wrote some (bad) fanfic set in that universe back in the days. When Majora's Mask came out I was almost bursting with excitement until I was actually able to play it and was again totally blown away by a unique experience. When I played Breath of the Wild, I felt ... nothing…

Good to get some other perspectives from OoT fans. I played it multiple times as a kid. No other video game came close in terms of the connection. It was the perfect game IMO.

My interest in video games declined greatly as the trend in the video game industry shifted toward heavy violence and more realistic graphics. Fast forward to last year, I decided to pick up the Switch as I found one for a really good deal. I wanted to try the new (to me) Zelda. I felt pretty unimpressed, decent not great. As it turned out, I had mistaken the much hyped BoTW release with the Zelda release that I bought. I was playing Skyward Sword.

Once I realized my error, I picked up BoTW and took it for spin. I now think the hype is totally justified. I got all the feelings I felt with OoT. It's been wonderful so far. I'm only about halfway through and stocked for Tears of the Kingdom.

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#519

Post by jprete »

codq wrote: post #427
keenmaster wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know man. Compare the ambience of Zora’s Domain, music and all, to the equivalent area in BOTW. Compare the divine beasts to literally any temple in OOT. BOTW doesn’t even come close to the magic of Ocarina imo. The story in OOT was also much better imo. Seeing Hyrule as a kid and beginning to love it, then seeing it waste away as Adult Link, and being motivated to defeat an enemy with clear character develop…

Again, ‘as a kid’ is what’s going on here. I also grew up with OoT, absolutely obsessed and life-defining in many ways. Now I’m a certified Old, and while BotW didn’t click for me initially, I grew to love it and soon understood it to be one of the greatest games I’ve ever played. That did require me to consider the context though, and force myself to play it with a type of ‘beginner’s mind’. A few months ago, I deci…

I have the same feeling about OoT but I find many old games to be extremely playable. I think the difference is that the highly replayable games have very responsive controls and throw you into the action very quickly. I could probably replay original Legend of Zelda and enjoy it, but I actually did try with Skyward Sword and the game is too much in the player’s way too often. BotW was very good at getting out of the player’s way and letting the player do things.

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Release

#520

Post by jghn »

rkangel wrote: post #282
johnchristopher wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but I'm still debating whether I play BoTW on Deck or Switch. Debating what ? Are you pulling the "IP owners don't make their products available on my platform so I am forced to pirate it" netflix card when you own the device the game is supposed to be played on ?

If you read my comment, I said I'd pay for it either way. At that point while I might be technically pirating, I don't think I am ethically.

You're also not paying for their hardware. Like Apple, since they own both sides of the equation, the hardware is part of their pricing model.

Unless you also own a switch, in which case disregard!

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