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Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

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Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#31

Post by tatrajim »

wslh wrote: post #10
hardware2win wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider reading the article The concerns are valid >Certain Kia or Hyundai models can be stolen using a screwdriver and a USB charging cord. >Cleveland, St. Louis and Seattle are among the other cities that started suing the the car companies earlier this year. Baltimore’s lawsuit says the companies “failed to keep up with industry standards,” and claim it was a result of business decisions made to reduce costs and…

The article sounds like if you leave the door open you should assume anybody will enter and steal you. This is reversing the victim to the victimary. In a sexist way would be similar that you are being raped because you wear some specific clothes. Or you are hacked because you don't apply a patch.

If a woman doesn't wear a titanium chastity belt, she can be deemed negligent.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#32

Post by sithadmin »

hardware2win wrote: post #6
alexb_ wrote: post #5

How is it Hyundai's fault that people steal cars? It's acting as if theives are some force of nature that we can't control or something. You prevent theft by putting theives in jail. It's not complicated.

Consider reading the article The concerns are valid >Certain Kia or Hyundai models can be stolen using a screwdriver and a USB charging cord. >Cleveland, St. Louis and Seattle are among the other cities that started suing the the car companies earlier this year. Baltimore’s lawsuit says the companies “failed to keep up with industry standards,” and claim it was a result of business decisions made to reduce costs and…

Nothing in the article nor the parts that you extracted establishes exactly why a municipality would have standing to sue a product manufacturer for damages, or why a manufacturer is somehow obligated to include features that a municipality deems to be 'standard'.

The fact that there are consumer products whose absence of features creates a negative externality for local law enforcement doesn't seem like sufficient grounds for standing, and this sort of thing is hardly limited to auto antitheft features. Awarding a municipality damages or other relief here would set precedent opening the door to all sorts of whacky things. Should spraypaint manufacturers be held liable for graffiti? Should speaker manufacturers that sell devices without decibel-output-limiters be held liable for noise complaints? The sane answer here to all of this seems like 'no'.

The appropriate venue for dealing with this is federal auto safety regulations, not municipalities trolling manufacturers in civil court.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#33

Post by hgsgm »

Government should mandate product standards before suing over them.

Government should thank Kia for making criminals easier to spot.

Government should raise fees for people who buy substandard cars and then waste city resources dealing with their trash.

Car owners could sue Kia for selling defective cars.

Insurance companies should charge far more for Kias.

Government should mandate insurance cost disclosures as part of car sales.

Problem solved.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#34

Post by cwoolfe »

alexb_ wrote: post #5

How is it Hyundai's fault that people steal cars? It's acting as if theives are some force of nature that we can't control or something. You prevent theft by putting theives in jail. It's not complicated.

Yes they are put in jail. But who bears the cost of extra policing, court time, jail space? The city does. So the city is seeking reparation from the cost incurred.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#36

Post by hgsgm »

aardvarkr wrote: post #8

Lots of comments that didn’t read the article so here’s a good excerpt on why there’s a lawsuit. Baltimore’s lawsuit says the companies “failed to keep up with industry standards,” and claim it was a result of business decisions made to reduce costs and boost profits “notwithstanding decades of academic literature and research supporting the deterrent effects” of anti-theft technology. “The dramatically increased rat…

Are these standards written somewhere?

If it's required, it should be documented.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#37

Post by chucksta »

ericmcer wrote: post #25
hardware2win wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider reading the article The concerns are valid >Certain Kia or Hyundai models can be stolen using a screwdriver and a USB charging cord. >Cleveland, St. Louis and Seattle are among the other cities that started suing the the car companies earlier this year. Baltimore’s lawsuit says the companies “failed to keep up with industry standards,” and claim it was a result of business decisions made to reduce costs and…

Are the spikes of car thefts similar across all cities? Every large city has Kia and Hyundais, you would think this would be a nationwide phenomenon.

Uh it is.. https://www.yahoo.com/news/nationwide-rise-kia-hyundai-car-2...

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#38

Post by oatmeal1 »

hardware2win wrote: post #6
alexb_ wrote: post #5

How is it Hyundai's fault that people steal cars? It's acting as if theives are some force of nature that we can't control or something. You prevent theft by putting theives in jail. It's not complicated.

Consider reading the article The concerns are valid >Certain Kia or Hyundai models can be stolen using a screwdriver and a USB charging cord. >Cleveland, St. Louis and Seattle are among the other cities that started suing the the car companies earlier this year. Baltimore’s lawsuit says the companies “failed to keep up with industry standards,” and claim it was a result of business decisions made to reduce costs and…

Public nuisance for having crimes committed against you is a ridiculous legal theory. It's victim blaming to the highest degree.

"Failing to keep up with industry standards" is also ridiculous because it's just a bandwagon fallacy.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#39

Post by hgsgm »

itsoktocry wrote: post #24
hardware2win wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider reading the article The concerns are valid >Certain Kia or Hyundai models can be stolen using a screwdriver and a USB charging cord. >Cleveland, St. Louis and Seattle are among the other cities that started suing the the car companies earlier this year. Baltimore’s lawsuit says the companies “failed to keep up with industry standards,” and claim it was a result of business decisions made to reduce costs and…

> “Hyundai and Kia’s decision to put cost savings and profits over public safety has had significant consequences for Baltimore and its residents..." Hyundai has some of the safest , most efficient small cars on the road, for great prices. I'd say these things are a net positive to "public safety" over all.

Do those great prices include the cost of recovering a stolen car?

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#40

Post by endisneigh »

ramraj07 wrote: post #29
endisneigh wrote: post #12

even after reading the article this lawsuit makes no sense. inherently a car that can easily be repaired can easily be stolen. the implication is that Baltimore does not want cars that can easily be modified so they cannot easily be stolen. troubling to say the least. then again, baltimore isn't exactly the pinnacle of governance. take the iphone for example, which are notoriously difficult to use if stolen. the resu…

Are you saying Hyundai and Kia did this so the car is more easily modifiable? Are they known for making more repairable cars? Are they framework laptop of the car world? Or merely cheap carmakers who found the wrong corner to cut and save costs?

what I'm saying is that if you imagine the most reparable car in the world, it would inherently be easy to steal and thus subject to the same lawsuit being presented to Kia and Hyundai.
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