As a dev with 3 yoe in canada ( so not a big market like Seattle or SF) what can I do to tell an employer to use me instead? Communication skills?
Lower cost perhaps? Canada being cheaper than the us it may be an incentive.
‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
81–90 of 155 posts
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#82This will get big pretty soon. It's been a trend for a while, my last few jobs we've had LATAM contractors. No time zone issues like with overseas and much less of a language and cultural barrier, like basically nonexistent compared to India. Average skill of LATAM devs is still low compared to the US, but they will learn and grow as more work moves there.
Agreed. The skill isn't even an issue - you just hire them for the right roles. Having the same definition of "no" as Americans is huge. Indians have a really tough time saying something isn't going well, or that we shouldn't do a project, for cultural reasons. That's great! Culture is great. For work though, something closer to the culture of the outsourcer makes it a lot easier to deal with. Flights are also so muc…
> Indians have a really tough time saying something isn't going well, or that we shouldn't do a project, for cultural reasons. That's great! Culture is great. For work though, something closer to the culture of the outsourcer makes it a lot easier to deal with.
It sounds like it’s not great. Indians are apparently losing business over it. And I suspect they’d be more efficient if they changed that aspect of their culture, at least for business.
I’m Bangladeshi and have the same inclination about bad news and saying “no.”[1] I’ve materially improved my career by channeling my west coast American wife in bluntly addressing bad news early, and saying “no” when something isn’t doable. (I still do the Indian “no” with my parents and it drives my wife nuts. “Why did you tell your mom you’d do that when you know you aren’t going to do that?”)
[1] I think it’s a characteristic of hierarchical, face-saving cultures in general, including the American south.
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is the situation with cartels? I like the idea of Mexico but tbf I'm terrified of even visiting for tourism because of the shooting/kidnapping stories. For example for the '24 eclipse I'm just sticking to Texas
There are 32 US cities, including Huston TX, with a higher homicide rate than Mexico City. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_homicide_rat... Foreigners getting kidnapped is very uncommon. It happens from time to time, although it makes it to the news and they do try to find the kidnappers. School shootings are extremely rare.
Why so many red flags on the State Department website then? Are you saying they're just wrong? https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/...
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#84A bit like in europe with eastern europe. Fun part is that given the lower taxes and cost of living people there earn more than those in the uk even if pay is lower is 20-30%. Thanks to ir35 and an insane drive to increase taxes that’s becoming more and more common. More expensive than india but also higher quality.
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hope for Mexico they dont follow the unhumane worker rights of the states. Basically europe has the same principles as in Mexico and people in Europe have good lifes.
It’s a trade off: countries that are hard to fire are also hard to hire. So your life is great in Europe once you secured employment, but employers are extra careful and very conservative in hiring.
Didn't the grandparent poster literally say "hire slow, fire fast"?
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#86This will get big pretty soon. It's been a trend for a while, my last few jobs we've had LATAM contractors. No time zone issues like with overseas and much less of a language and cultural barrier, like basically nonexistent compared to India. Average skill of LATAM devs is still low compared to the US, but they will learn and grow as more work moves there.
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Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#87I can speak for Mexico. We have so much going for it. 1. A robust manufacturing economy (unlike the rest of LATAM) right on the border with the #1 consumer. 2. A culture that is easy to digest for Americans and Europeans alike. 3. People that are welcoming of foreigners, and used to them thanks to decades of tourism. 4. A relatively educated and increasingly educated population. 5. A very comprehensive free trade agr…
What is the situation with cartels? I like the idea of Mexico but tbf I'm terrified of even visiting for tourism because of the shooting/kidnapping stories. For example for the '24 eclipse I'm just sticking to Texas
I've talked with people outside the United States that are terrified to send their loved ones here for similar reasons. It's an old media canard to highlight the most extreme aspects of a country and hold them up as typical.
When you visit a foreign country it is best to do your research. For instance, if you visit California and spend your vacation in Stockton or San Bernardino you should take some basic precautions that the natives already do. Some countries are honestly dangerous, but Mexico isn't bad for tourism unless you are actively seeking the more dangerous parts.
The major problems are when you start bringing your business into the country. That is a whole new kettle of fish. At that point you need to work the system to acquire a patronage network or work with established interests.
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Could you explain more what you mean with Americans & Indians having different definitions of "no"?
In Indian culture, it is considered rude to say "No", so you will never get a direct No from them. "Can you do this?" - "Yes, I'll do my best" most likely means that you won't get what you asked for.
Correct -"I'll do my best" is "No." "I can do it/I will do the needful" is an _actual_ "yes"
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#89Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hope for Mexico they dont follow the unhumane worker rights of the states. Basically europe has the same principles as in Mexico and people in Europe have good lifes.
It’s a trade off: countries that are hard to fire are also hard to hire. So your life is great in Europe once you secured employment, but employers are extra careful and very conservative in hiring.
I think most European countries still allow for probationary periods; if I recall correctly they can stretch into years in some cases.
Surely 6 months is enough to figure out whether or not someone will be a dud. Maybe you won’t know their full potential at that point but you should have a good idea of whether or not they meet minimum standards.
Re: ‘Nearshoring’ Push Is Fueling Tech Job Demand in Latin America
#90I am a lead on a project that uses a 'nearshore' team to augment a very small team of very senior devs. 20+ years each respectively.
That decision was made above me, but has turned out well. Code quality is good and the pay should cause concern US developers.
This is an enterprise system with an Angular 15 front-end. Just the front-end is complex enough that it requires strong understanding of how to write proper Angular/RxJs reactive code, with a highly dynamic UI, on top of all of the Angular fundamentals.
The code is of quality you would expect from an experienced developer, and done on time.
I look at some of the salaries for similar front-end work in SV/SF and it is so out of line compared to this I don't know what to say. "High cost of living" can be discussed all day, but then companies can just hire someone who isn't in a high cost of living area who can do the same thing. For a lot less.
US software engineering is facing multiple challenges on all fronts. We have a lot of junior developers out of bootcamps who can't find work due to saturation, we have nearshore companies with skilled engineers that cost a fraction of what the US employee would cost, and now we have AI like GTP-4 that is very strong when provided with the right prompts.
We'll see how this all turns out.