Live data from Hacker News

Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

techradar.com

171–180 of 344 posts

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#171
post #85

Before anyone jumps to conclusions, all this ruling means is that this example of an iOS virtual machine (for the purpose of security research) counts as fair use. It doesn't exactly open the doors for everyone to run iOS in virtual machines.

From the ruling[0]: > As to count one, we agree that Corellium is shielded by the fair use doctrine. First, Corellium’s virtualization software is transformative—it furthers scientific progress by allowing security research into important operating systems. Second, iOS is functional operating software that falls outside copyright’s core. Third, Corellium didn’t overhelp itself to Apple’s software. And fourth, Corelli…

All you are quoting is a description of how Corellium’s use qualifies as fair use, which is what the person responding to you said.

> The important part here is that it proves Apple does not have the defacto right to claim infringement on iOS. If your emulator is transformative, offers functionality beyond default iOS, doesn't abuse their services and doesn't threaten the iOS market (eg. iPhones) it should be considered lawful.

You are describing fair use. This isn’t establishing the precedent you think it is. Corellium said “hey, what we are doing is fair use” and the court agreed, describing why it was fair use. That’s all. The description of how it counts as fair use is not opening anything new up, that’s just the four factors of fair use that have been there all along.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#172
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alrighty then, kindly send me money amounting to 25% of your annual expenses. I'm told such fees are harmless.

Are you making my app searchable and downloadable on 1B devices? Because hell yeah I’ll take that deal. I paid Apple 30% on about $1M of revenue that would have been less than $10k without them. You think I feel abused?

End of the day you're still at the mercy of apple's algorithms and policies. If one day apple decides your app isn't worth it and the purchases and downloads slow to a crawl, you'll be taking note that the tax you're paying isn't worth it anymore. You'll search around but realize all the platforms do the same thing and regret it.

Competition for small business like yours is a good thing and you should be earning more compared to the big platforms because you bring in the customers, end of story.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#173

It's funny how the 30% tax and App Store nonsense automatically makes me want Apple to lose every single court case in perpetuity. Having such a monopoly on a device you purchase really means the legal system needs to take you down a notch.

> the 30% tax

15%. Almost everybody pays 15%, not 30%. The only organisations who pay 30% earn over a million dollars a year from things other than long-term subscriptions. That’s a tiny minority.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#174
post #159
post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does Apple dogfood their OS X/iOS CI pipelines, i.e. are they running them on some off-the-shelf Macs like they expect everyone else to do? I remember reading that at least in the past they were running virtualized OS X on regular servers for those (actually found following: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18117885 ). And it's not like Apple would need to verify anything. They can grant the license, but say that…

Azure doesn't run on Windows. Why would iCloud run on MacOS? There's exactly one organization in the world that needs to run iCloud, why would MacOS target that use case? I doubt Apple eats their own dogfood.

Azure does run on Windows. It's HyperV server below the rest of the hardware. It's a custom Windows install that you can't purchase, but it's Windows none the less.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#175
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They weren't trying to tell you what to do with your machine, they were trying to tell you what you were not allowed to do with THEIR software.

This reminds me of when Apple tried to make it so that you can't own an iPhone, only lease it. The effort might be still ongoing, I'm not up to date. A few different turns in history and your sentence would have been "THEIR machine" and "THEIR software".

The fact that (baring exploitable bugs) you can only run Apple approved software on an iOS device pretty much makes it "THEIR machine" anyway.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#176
post #36
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's been working out fine for the Steam Deck. Sure, you can install Windows and/or any other storefront, but you won't have the console-like experience that Valve's own software provides. It's trivially easy to install pirated games on the Deck, without any cracking or modification of the system. You never have to make a single Steam purchase after buying the Deck, but Valve's betting that you will. And they're righ…

I mean... working fine, in that the only people who buy them are pretty techy. It's not so easy to get Win 10 working right, it requires a fair bit of effort, and the experience sucks. I'm not so sure Steam would be super happy if Epic started distributing a new frontend and store through their marketplace. I'm quite sure they wouldn't let them.

Steam sells games which require third-party launchers to work. For example: Red Dead Redemption 2 requires the Rockstar Launcher to work (many a negative steam review regarding this), and this launcher allows you to buy other Rockstar games (The GTA franchise, LA Noire and more).

So yeah, Steam definitely allows distribution of storefronts.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#177
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be extremely surprised if Valve attempted to block Epic from doing that.

Really? They specifically don't allow distribution of anything but games, which would preclude a storefront, presumably.

They distribute games from both EA and Ubisoft that force you to use both companies launchers, that also just so happen to come with there own stores attached.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that a solution, or an additional poison?

Why would it be an additional poison? It's solving problems in my life. I have a calendar, it's synced across all my devices, I have no fear of lock-in, and I have full control over my data without fearing about my account getting locked (as I pay for Workspace). Same for email, same for contacts. What's the poison there?

Sounds like you’ve just chosen to lock yourself into a different vendor, only one that integrates less elegantly with your device.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#179
What I want to do is not have to have a unified build system for multiple platforms and ABIs without any problem, but for some reason, to target anything apple, I have to use a physical apple machine.

It's absolutely abusing market position, because it ends up being that in my profession, you end up purchasing mac computers for the whole office, because then you can target all platforms without any fuss. Not because the hardware or software has any merits, but because they artificially restrict these use cases so that's the only option to target a significant market.

Re: Apple just lost its lawsuit trying to ban iOS virtual machines

#180

What I want to do is not have to have a unified build system for multiple platforms and ABIs without any problem, but for some reason, to target anything apple, I have to use a physical apple machine. It's absolutely abusing market position, because it ends up being that in my profession, you end up purchasing mac computers for the whole office, because then you can target all platforms without any fuss. Not because…

It's on the expensive side, I know, but have you considered using bitrise.io?
Post reply on HN