Slime molds are also incredibly beautiful and diverse. There's a photographer whose specialty is gorgeous macro shots of slime molds. https://mymodernmet.com/barry-webb-slime-mold/
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Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
21–30 of 32 posts
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#22I for one welcome our new physarum polycephalum overlords.
You might like the book Children of Ruin by Adrian Tchaikovsky.
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#23Why do journalists insist that very simple conditional algorithms are analogous to intelligence? Is the same true for evolution? These are simple heuristic processes.
Maybe this simply speaks to the quality of education or the exposure of the average person to algorithms and conditional logic.
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#24Earlier quoted context omitted.
Try this lens: dragonflies are one of nature's most incredible predators, with a 90-97% success rate of hunts. The precise data varies, but almost all more complex animals have a dramatically lower success rate. Well, so what? Harbour porpoises have a ~90% success rate, too. It's interesting because dragonflies only have about 10,000 neurons, whereas harbour porpoises have like 14 and a half billion. Slime molds aren…
Dragonfly neurons encode an extremely good hunter / seeker missile algorithm but they can’t solve other types of problems. So it can’t be argued that dragonflies are generally intelligent. There is more evidence for bee intelligence.
Neither I nor the article argue for general intelligence in slime molds or dragonflies. Kind of a strange point for you to make, frankly.
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
Both slime molds and dragonflies are amazing because they flaunt much of what we know/believe about intelligence. Neurons are obviously excellent at handling and developing "intelligent" behavior, but it turns out they're not as necessary as we thought and there may be extreme efficiency gains possible (for specialized problems) over what traditional neural architecture indicates.
Except aren't slime molds on the extreme end of inefficiency , seeing how they solve problems by physically exploring the problem space? Being able to map the environment remotely, via senses like sight and hearing, and being able to solve problems computationally, "in mind space", are huge efficiency wins.
I was more referring to dragonflies' low neuron count with efficiency, but really efficiency is relative. You're describing speed, or efficiency with respect to time. We're able to do these things faster than a slime mold, but it take a lot more energy. Slime molds can be dropped on the floor and start solving problems, we have to build tools to hunt animals to roast over a fire we've built so we can sleep in a shelter we've built.
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
Except aren't slime molds on the extreme end of inefficiency , seeing how they solve problems by physically exploring the problem space? Being able to map the environment remotely, via senses like sight and hearing, and being able to solve problems computationally, "in mind space", are huge efficiency wins.
I was more referring to dragonflies' low neuron count with efficiency, but really efficiency is relative. You're describing speed, or efficiency with respect to time. We're able to do these things faster than a slime mold, but it take a lot more energy. Slime molds can be dropped on the floor and start solving problems, we have to build tools to hunt animals to roast over a fire we've built so we can sleep in a shelt…
I'm just thinking in terms of energy expenditure on the margin. Humans need more energy to sustain themselves, but for a given cognitive task, I imagine they need to expend less energy than slime mold - being able to solve problems by gathering photons and sending electrons down a maze is much more energy-efficient than having to move or grow your body, made of matter, to solve the same problem by touch alone.
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was more referring to dragonflies' low neuron count with efficiency, but really efficiency is relative. You're describing speed, or efficiency with respect to time. We're able to do these things faster than a slime mold, but it take a lot more energy. Slime molds can be dropped on the floor and start solving problems, we have to build tools to hunt animals to roast over a fire we've built so we can sleep in a shelt…
I'm just thinking in terms of energy expenditure on the margin. Humans need more energy to sustain themselves, but for a given cognitive task, I imagine they need to expend less energy than slime mold - being able to solve problems by gathering photons and sending electrons down a maze is much more energy-efficient than having to move or grow your body, made of matter, to solve the same problem by touch alone.
That's fair and may. I don't know what the caloric needs of a slime mold are. But this is completely off topic, tbh. The point is that they solve problems in a way that is alien to us, and alien intelligence is interesting. I may have given a poor explanation before, but efficiency is not the important part.
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#28I thought that's what we had w/ Elon in charge?
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#29I find the “super computer slime” stories that pop up every once and a while (including in academic contexts, occasionally), pretty annoying. Usually they have fun examples of problems these things can solve, but we don’t actually think they’re doing something fundamentally different from a greedy algorithm or trial and error optimization? And they’re slow as slow can be. So, not that exciting?
Try this lens: dragonflies are one of nature's most incredible predators, with a 90-97% success rate of hunts. The precise data varies, but almost all more complex animals have a dramatically lower success rate. Well, so what? Harbour porpoises have a ~90% success rate, too. It's interesting because dragonflies only have about 10,000 neurons, whereas harbour porpoises have like 14 and a half billion. Slime molds aren…
maybe more complex animals don't have as high a success rate because capturing the prey they go after is a more complicated problem.
Re: Let slime moulds do the thinking (2010)
#30Also note this evergreen presentation comparing organizations to slime molds: