Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

text.npr.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 200 posts

Re: People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

#21

Post by splendidHaiku »

DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #8

I'm confused how courts will deal with this in the future. We are just entering the age of deep fake voices, convincing ones at least. And there are bound to be plenty of deep fakes that sound like the real person but aren't. Are we now going to be held liable for deepfakes we didn't make? I'm surprised people aren't using this more for divorces and what not. Create a deepfake of your wife and then say "Here's proof…

Everything will be considered fake unless it is proven authentic.

How do we prove authentic? Same way we prove that a website we visit is authentic. Every recording made will be signed/hashed and be able to validate of the public key of the recording device (every phone will have a key). White House, News Orgs, etc. all will use cameras with public keys so everyone can validate. As soon as only one pixel or frequency changes, it will be invalid/fake.

In the end, all will be even more trustworthy than today (there will be some kind of signed/verification label on every video/audio/media that is original/valid).

Re: People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

#22

Post by noughtme »

ccvannorman wrote: post #5

"Tesla lawyers argue Musk cannot be held accountable for public statements [about car safety] because anyone could have made a deepfake of Musk, so no public statements can be taken seriously." Court laughs.

This doesn’t seem unreasonable. Isn’t this already the case for politicians in the US? (Not related to deepfakes, just any public statement). Wouldn’t any legal matters defer to written contracts and TOS?

Re: People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

#23

Post by intrasight »

I tell my lawyer friends who are early in their careers that they should build a practice in this area. It's going to be HUGE.

My personal opinion is that in a legal court setting that the burden of proof of an audio or video recording being real should be with the party presenting the evidence. Court standards for provenance need to be met before any recordings can even be shown to a jury.

Re: People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

#24

Post by johndhi »

d23 wrote: post #2

Any attorneys here that can discuss the nuances involved in knowingly lying to the court, which I believe carries penalties for the attorney? And why / whether that would or wouldn’t apply here?

I'm a lawyer. Lol at the other answers.

It definitely carries penalties for the attorney. Each US state has passed 'rules of professional conduct' that govern rules that apply to barred attorneys. Lying to a tribunal, or lying to your client, is illegal and you can be disbarred and fined for it.

Haven't read this case closely but it sounds to me like the attorneys said "it's possible these are deep fakes" and not "these are deepfakes." The former seems like a reasonable argument to make, but according to the judge, a flawed one.

Re: People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

#25

Post by sharemywin »

ianferrel wrote: post #19
DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #8

I'm confused how courts will deal with this in the future. We are just entering the age of deep fake voices, convincing ones at least. And there are bound to be plenty of deep fakes that sound like the real person but aren't. Are we now going to be held liable for deepfakes we didn't make? I'm surprised people aren't using this more for divorces and what not. Create a deepfake of your wife and then say "Here's proof…

This isn't a new problem with video, but a new twist on an old problem: manufactured evidence. One way that courts deal with it is enhanced scrutiny on disputed evidence. Like, if you show up to a court with a document that you claimed someone signed, and they claim they didn't sign it, then the court can keep digging until they figure out who is lying. They can look for witnesses. They can subpoena records from inte…

perjury isn't looked to kindly on in the courts.

Re: People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

#28

Post by infinitifall »

izzydata wrote: post #17
DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #8

I'm confused how courts will deal with this in the future. We are just entering the age of deep fake voices, convincing ones at least. And there are bound to be plenty of deep fakes that sound like the real person but aren't. Are we now going to be held liable for deepfakes we didn't make? I'm surprised people aren't using this more for divorces and what not. Create a deepfake of your wife and then say "Here's proof…

Videos are easy enough to spot as fakes for now, but I've heard really convincing AI audio fakes. Audio only recordings might not be usable as evidence without additional confirmation of authenticity.

What would "additional confirmation" look like?

Are audio/video recordings I take with my phone going to be useless in a decade because deepfakes are virtually indistinguishable and there is no "additional confirmation"?

Re: People are trying to claim real videos are deepfakes

#30

Post by cma »

splendidHaiku wrote: post #21
DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #8

I'm confused how courts will deal with this in the future. We are just entering the age of deep fake voices, convincing ones at least. And there are bound to be plenty of deep fakes that sound like the real person but aren't. Are we now going to be held liable for deepfakes we didn't make? I'm surprised people aren't using this more for divorces and what not. Create a deepfake of your wife and then say "Here's proof…

Everything will be considered fake unless it is proven authentic. How do we prove authentic? Same way we prove that a website we visit is authentic. Every recording made will be signed/hashed and be able to validate of the public key of the recording device (every phone will have a key). White House, News Orgs, etc. all will use cameras with public keys so everyone can validate. As soon as only one pixel or frequency…

You could take a picture of a picture or a recording of a recording and now it is validated.
Post reply on HN