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Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

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Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#131

Post by mindslight »

PrimeMcFly wrote: post #124
mindslight wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's even crappier for workers when bosses dictate that tips should be pooled or whatever. Your comment made me think - I wonder if a way of reigning in this weaponization of tipping culture would be state laws for transparency of where tips actually go. Let's say anywhere that solicits tips must clearly post how that money is divided up (on the menu, tip jar, POS terminal, prominent signs, etc). Whether it all goe…

I agree with you that tipping transparency would be good, but honestly they should just raise the minimum wage and stop worker exploitation, that's a much better solution.

While I agree with the thrust of your comment, I don't think that's a solution to tipping - the same dynamic would still exist, because it's effectively a form of differentiated pricing based on how much you can guilt each customer.

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#132

Post by sheepybloke »

Pre-tipping is also getting out of hand. I was looking at doing a train dining experience in Colorado for my wife's birthday, and they automatically added in a 20% gratuity to your bill. At that point, it's not actually tipping, that's just a huge fee.

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#133

Post by flashgordon »

corey_moncure wrote: post #34

I took my wife out to a fancy steakhouse over the weekend and remembered what "service" is supposed to be. Our waiter poured my wine, cut up our steak table side and served us, cracked pepper over our salad, went above and beyond in every way to ensure that we were comfortable and satisfied. I gladly tipped him 20% on $300 and would do so again. On the other hand, I left $10 on top of a $50 takeout order at a local I…

So I have started actively either saying no tip (on takeout orders) or actually taking my time (even muttering my thoughts) by pressing the "other amount" button and entering a very arbitrary but low amount. I am waiting for someone to ask me what I am doing so I can start my diatribe on "well I am not American so I don't get tipping. I thought pizza was X$ so what's with this. Aren't your employers paying your fair share? If not why aren't you revolting? Oh you are a family outfit?...". I have a whole tree of q and a prepared. I am sad no one has triggered the root!

The only downside is I avoid going to the same place again Incase they remember me and decide to spit in my food or worse!

By the way I will gladly pay more. I just don't want to be surprised by extra costs (not publicizing tax is another thing that irks me too)

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#134

Post by ricardobayes »

Night_Thastus wrote: post #117
doublepg23 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Excessive tips are the only way a lot of people working in the service industry survive at all. When the topic comes up on Reddit the people overwhelmingly against getting rid of tipping are waiters. Heck, bartenders are even more vehemently against the idea.

They're against the idea because a world where they get that pay consistently instead of by tips seems fictional. People who advocate for getting rid of tipping sound like they're trying to take away a good chunk of their income. Plus, instead of thinking about potentially low tipping periods and how averages work, they think about missing out on that sweet $300 tip they might make at some point if they get lucky.

Respectfully, I would disagree. If you leave loose change in a Parisian bar, the waiter will run after you on the street that you forgot your money. No-tip culture absolutaly can work, look at France and Japan, among many others. Still they are renowned for their restaurant culture.

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#135

Post by flashgordon »

ricardobayes wrote: post #128
polski-g wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I have to wait in line, I do not tip.

As a programmer, I threw an exception here. If you have to wait in line to be seated for table service, what do you do?

Well then the tip depends on quality of (eventual) service no? And I'd even say one of the determinants of service quality would be how long you had to wait in line.

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#136

Post by ricardobayes »

disruptiveink wrote: post #71

As a non-US citizen/resident, I can't wait for Americans to finally riot against tipping, just so they stop doing it abroad. A shame that it had to take comical proportions domestically for people to start questioning it. Americans tipping abroad while on holidays ruins service for everyone that isn't American – as a non-American you are guaranteed to get worse service than a American in touristy places (and sometime…

This is going like this for a long time, as a local in Eastern Europe I was sick and tired of getting a frown or a shit service, but the American couple next to me had "their feet kissed" so to say. This creates the weird duality you see on many sites that Americans are raving about eastern european places but the locals always comment "what? no, don't come here, it's crap here".

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#137

Post by ricardobayes »

disruptiveink wrote: post #115
yowzadave wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> hospitality obviously optimises for being extra nice to Americans and treat everyone else with apathy Maybe this is how the tipping practice got started in the first place?

Ignoring for a moment the 20% premium, the issue is that in the US, (mostly) everyone is American. Unless you're a regular, hospitality has no way of telling whether you're a good tipper or a bad tipper. There may be "tells" or "feelings", but that's the extent of it. So when you walk into a place, you're going to get the same service as the next guy. Your logic may track for regulars (a repeat customer may tip to ge…

I don't think this would work in Munich or Vienna, you could be the pope and they would still be rude to you.

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#138

Post by noisy_boy »

chapium wrote: post #52
noisy_boy wrote: post #9

Do I get to pay less if the service is crappy? If no, then why should I get pressurized to pay more, even when the service is just what I expected? My appreciation for the great service will be reflected in my repeat patronage. Obviously there can be exceptions e.g. if I don't have any plans to revisit, say when I am traveling or someone going wayyy above and beyond their role etc. My company pays my bonus when I hav…

Simply, its not a bonus and its not for service. Its so the employer can pay less when business is slow.

Correct, and I get that. I'm just pointing out that logically tips are bonuses and they should also be paid by the employers, on top of a living wage, as is the norm in general outside service sector. It should not be paid by the customers.

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#139

Post by ricardobayes »

flashgordon wrote: post #135
ricardobayes wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a programmer, I threw an exception here. If you have to wait in line to be seated for table service, what do you do?

Well then the tip depends on quality of (eventual) service no? And I'd even say one of the determinants of service quality would be how long you had to wait in line.

Maybe, although in my experience in America you almost always need to wait in line, even for a steakhouse. In Europe, much less, in London a few restaurants but I don't recall ever needing to wait in other countries.

Re: Tipping at self-checkout has customers crying ‘emotional blackmail’

#140

Post by PrimeMcFly »

mindslight wrote: post #131
PrimeMcFly wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you that tipping transparency would be good, but honestly they should just raise the minimum wage and stop worker exploitation, that's a much better solution.

While I agree with the thrust of your comment, I don't think that's a solution to tipping - the same dynamic would still exist, because it's effectively a form of differentiated pricing based on how much you can guilt each customer.

I don't understand. Minimum wage as a reasonable price would eliminate tipping altogether in most low-end to medium rate restaurants - the means through which they guilt the customer would be eliminated.

People would still try, and it would take a while for the culture to dissipate entirely, but most people would eventually realize there would be no reason to tip and so wouldn't.

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